New Sub-Forum...

[ppo]

Originally Posted by ppo

I and make it a stiky append in the Math forum,
Pierpaolo.

oops, sticky, not stiky ....
my english getting rusty, or my brain getting old....
Pierpaolo

[xilman]

Originally Posted by ppo

oops, sticky, not stiky ....
my english getting rusty, or my brain getting old....
Pierpaolo

Probably just finger trouble. I get it all the time.

Paul

[xilman]

Originally Posted by ppo

I hope that this will NOT mean that all of you "super_experts" (Alex, Phil, Bob, Paul, George, etc.). will stop helping us common people in replying to our "stupid" questions in the Math (and others) forum....

I'm no super_expert (indeed, I'm just a dumb chemist by training and sysadmin by occupation) so evidently you must mean another Paul, or be uncommonly good at flattery, or just plain deluded. However, I'll continue to do what I can for people who show some evidence that they want to learn what little I can provide.


Paul

[philmoore]

I see that a number of threads have been moved into the "Cranks, Kooks, and Miscellaneous Malfeasants" subforum of the math forum. Browsing through these, I see that a number of these threads, although perhaps initiated with gems of misinformation, actually contain a fair amount of useful clarification and elucidation on the topics concerned, and a number of these threads attracted enough interest from other participants in this forum to generate discussions running to 50 or more posts. A number of other threads which had previously vanished into relative obscurity have now been elevated to an unfortunate new level of notoriety. Quite frankly, this makes me very uncomfortable. Why should certain individuals have the power to decide which threads are of value and which get moved to the "Crank" subforum? Anyone may ignore postings that don't seem to make sense, and if you feel you must respond, why not just say "This person is a crank" and sit back and let it ride? I would prefer to merge all these threads back into the regular math forum. As it exists now, this subforum just looks like a way of making fun of people, some of whom are well-intentioned and guilty of nothing more than asking an uninformed question. Is the subforum a way of "protecting" readers who can not tell the difference between logical arguments and fallacies? If we feel that we need this sort of protection, I would prefer that we institute some kind of a more democratic process to carry it out.

[ppo]

Originally Posted by philmoore

I Quite frankly, this makes me very uncomfortable.

Me too.
Pierpaolo

[Numbers]

Originally Posted by philmoore

If we feel that we need this sort of protection, I would prefer that we institute some kind of a more democratic process to carry it out.

Me too. I was never in favour of it in the first place.

[ppo]

at least, could we have another name for it ?

[Xyzzy]

Pending input from our two math forum moderators (ewmayer and philmoore) I will temporarily rename the new forum in a few minutes...

You must understand that I trust our moderators without question... They are much closer to the front lines than I am... They also have forgotten more about math than I will ever learn...

In this case we have a situation where the moderators are not in total agreement... This is okay... Stuff like this happens all the time... I trust they will find a solution that works...

I am actually glad this situation has come about... We've needed a solution to this situation for a long time... Perhaps Ernst's intent was to bring this out in the open, dramatically, to force us to deal with it head on... I know he has a perverse sense of humor, which I personally find to be entertaining... I can't claim to know what any of our moderators are thinking, but I know their nature, and none of them are mean or spiteful people... I consider all of them to be very good people...

It has been my experience that moderating a forum is a thankless job... There is no way to please everyone... I also know we don't pay them nearly enough...

Personally, I have learned a great deal from ewmayer and philmoore... They are part of the foundation which makes mersenneforum.org such a wonderful place... I'm honored just to know them... Being able to consider them friends is a real treat...

[ppo]

Originally Posted by Xyzzy

Pending input from our two math forum moderators (ewmayer and philmoore) I will temporarily rename the new forum in a few minutes...

You must understand that I trust our moderators without question... They are much closer to the front lines than I am... They also have forgotten more about math than I will ever learn...

In this case we have a situation where the moderators are not in total agreement... This is okay... Stuff like this happens all the time... I trust they will find a solution that works...

I am actually glad this situation has come about... We've needed a solution to this situation for a long time... Perhaps Ernst's intent was to bring this out in the open, dramatically, to force us to deal with it head on... I know he has a perverse sense of humor, which I personally find to be entertaining... I can't claim to know what any of our moderators are thinking, but I know their nature, and none of them are mean or spiteful people... I consider all of them to be very good people...

It has been my experience that moderating a forum is a thankless job... There is no way to please everyone... I also know we don't pay them nearly enough...

Personally, I have learned a great deal from ewmayer and philmoore... They are part of the foundation which makes mersenneforum.org such a wonderful place... I'm honored just to know them... Being able to consider them friends is a real treat...

I do agree

[OmbooHankvald]

I think that a research-subforum would probably be great (I'm too dumb to use it ), but does that mean that "math" becomes "newbie-math" or what happens?
I think I'm repeating myself, but I think Xyzzys idea of a beginners-math forum is really great.
I am certain that many potentially interested people don't want to ask questions in the math-forum because of the "cryptic" questions/answers already there, but would be more comfortable with a place where someone explained the things dead-simple and all sorts of dumb questions were allowed.
Then, when the user has gained some basic knowledge, they can head on to the real math-stuff in other forums.

Many people are probably only participating in GIMPS for the money. If any of those should become interested in "what that GIMPS-stuff is all about" then I would gladly volunteer to provide whatever support I can in an eventual beginner-math forum.

Combine it with a research forum, ban all the cranks and I believe all parts would be satisfied

I think this topic is too important to be ignored!

[xilman]

Originally Posted by OmbooHankvald

I am certain that many potentially interested people don't want to ask questions in the math-forum because of the "cryptic" questions/answers already there, but would be more comfortable with a place where someone explained the things dead-simple and all sorts of dumb questions were allowed.

Unfortunately, some newbies don't want to ask questions. They want to expound on their ideas. As I see it, it is the latter class that cause the irritation, not the former. Bob, perhaps, expresses his irritation more forcefullly than most but he seems very willing to answer questions which are reasonably well posed. Sometimes the best answer is indeed to give a text or two where the answer can be read. Sometimes the questions are so difficult to interpret (a polite way of saying appear to be gibberish) that the only reasonable response is a request that the questioner rephrase their question.

Paul