Move 55

paulunderwood · 2014-11-23, 12:58

Here, I think we should play:

55.Kf2 Ng7

:smile:

Brian-E · 2014-11-23, 13:13

I too think 55...Ng7 is the move which leaves their forced mate hardest to find. (And I think moves which give up a piece to stave off mate are just pointless.)

David's analysis a few moves ago was:
[QUOTE=henryzz;387034]Assuming you meant Rf5+
53.Rf7 Ne6
54.Rf5+ Kg4
55.Kf2

55...Ng7
56.Rb5 Kh3
57.Kg1 Bd4+
58.Kh1 Kg4
59.Kg2 and mate is assured

55...Bd4
56.Kg2 mate is assured

55...Nd4
56.h3+ Kxh3
57.Rh5+ mate is assured

I can also find mate for Nf4 but not yet for Be1+. Of course neither are good.

I find it weird how I get into sessions of being able to think loads about a position fairly well. I am having to record where I am upto today but doing well. Keep finding escapes for me to refute.[/QUOTE]
I see nothing better. Other possibilities 55...Ng5 56.Rf4+ and 57.Rh4 mate, or 55...Kh3 56.Rh5+ Kg4 57.Bd1 mate or 55...h5 56.Kg2 (threat h3 mate) Ng5 57.Rf4 mate, or 55...Bb4 56.Kg2 Ng5 57.Rf4+ Kh5 58.Rh4 mate are hardly worth mentioning.

Their winning line in David's analysis following 55...Ng7 at least requires them to demonstrate that they can find it.

Brian-E · 2014-11-25, 17:39

... and this is exciting, 55...Ng7 takes an early lead with two clear votes, but other moves are right there waiting for their supporters, and two of the team are hesitating, will they plump for 55...Bb4 perhaps, or 55...Kh3, will they make their team-mates change their minds? It's thrilling, the spectators are on the edge of their seats, I think we're about to see another vote...

paulunderwood · 2014-11-25, 17:51

55... Kh3 leads to Rh5+ and we lose our h pawn. :sad:

What do you see gained by 55...Bb4?

Brian-E · 2014-11-25, 18:05

[QUOTE=paulunderwood;388394]55... Kh3 leads to Rh5+ and we lose our h pawn. :sad:

What do you see gained by 55...Bb4?[/QUOTE]
Both 55...Kh3 and 55...Bb4 allow White to mate quickly as I wrote in post #2. I'm just rather facetiously trying to encourage our other two team members to contribute so that we can keep the game moving. But of course they're both busy, I understand that.:smile:

paulunderwood · 2014-11-25, 18:22

Well, my vote is for Ng7. That covers h5, which is attacked by White's Rook, and f5 which is attacked by White's Bishop and is attacking White's Rook there. It is then defended by our Bishop. So White has to move its Rook, and, in order to maintain the boxing in of our King, the most likely target squares are d5 or b5. :smile:

Brian-E · 2014-11-25, 18:27

Yes. My vote is also 55...Ng7. David showed how they then mate us a couple of moves ago, but it's the move which makes it toughest for them, for reasons which you write.

Over to David and Rich.

paulunderwood · 2014-11-25, 18:30

Maybe there are some alternatives with David's Ng7 line, which we might see as the game progresses. :smile:

Brian-E · 2014-11-25, 18:31

Yes, maybe, let's hope so.:smile:

henryzz · 2014-11-25, 21:31

Sorry I forgot to post. Ng7 is probably the one to go for. If we were trying to make the game last as long as possible I would go for Be1+ as I haven't seen mate with it yet.

richs · 2014-11-27, 01:38

Here is Be1+ line:

55. ... Be1+
56. Kg2 Bxg3
57. hxg3 Nd4
58. Rf4 Kg5
59. Rxf4 Kf6

and we are basically helpless....

2014-11-23, 12:58	#1
paulunderwood Sep 2002 Database er0rr 11115₈ Posts	Move 55 Here, I think we should play: 55.Kf2 Ng7 :smile:

2014-11-25, 17:51	#4
paulunderwood Sep 2002 Database er0rr 5·937 Posts	55... Kh3 leads to Rh5+ and we lose our h pawn. :sad: What do you see gained by 55...Bb4? Last fiddled with by paulunderwood on 2014-11-25 at 17:52

2014-11-25, 18:22	#6
paulunderwood Sep 2002 Database er0rr 11115₈ Posts	Well, my vote is for Ng7. That covers h5, which is attacked by White's Rook, and f5 which is attacked by White's Bishop and is attacking White's Rook there. It is then defended by our Bishop. So White has to move its Rook, and, in order to maintain the boxing in of our King, the most likely target squares are d5 or b5. :smile: Last fiddled with by paulunderwood on 2014-11-25 at 18:23

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2014-11-23, 13:13	#2
Brian-E "Brian" Jul 2007 The Netherlands 2×11×149 Posts	I too think 55...Ng7 is the move which leaves their forced mate hardest to find. (And I think moves which give up a piece to stave off mate are just pointless.) David's analysis a few moves ago was: [QUOTE=henryzz;387034]Assuming you meant Rf5+ 53.Rf7 Ne6 54.Rf5+ Kg4 55.Kf2 55...Ng7 56.Rb5 Kh3 57.Kg1 Bd4+ 58.Kh1 Kg4 59.Kg2 and mate is assured 55...Bd4 56.Kg2 mate is assured 55...Nd4 56.h3+ Kxh3 57.Rh5+ mate is assured I can also find mate for Nf4 but not yet for Be1+. Of course neither are good. I find it weird how I get into sessions of being able to think loads about a position fairly well. I am having to record where I am upto today but doing well. Keep finding escapes for me to refute.[/QUOTE] I see nothing better. Other possibilities 55...Ng5 56.Rf4+ and 57.Rh4 mate, or 55...Kh3 56.Rh5+ Kg4 57.Bd1 mate or 55...h5 56.Kg2 (threat h3 mate) Ng5 57.Rf4 mate, or 55...Bb4 56.Kg2 Ng5 57.Rf4+ Kh5 58.Rh4 mate are hardly worth mentioning. Their winning line in David's analysis following 55...Ng7 at least requires them to demonstrate that they can find it. Last fiddled with by Brian-E on 2014-11-23 at 13:21 Reason: extra line added

2014-11-25, 17:39	#3
Brian-E "Brian" Jul 2007 The Netherlands 2×11×149 Posts	... and this is exciting, 55...Ng7 takes an early lead with two clear votes, but other moves are right there waiting for their supporters, and two of the team are hesitating, will they plump for 55...Bb4 perhaps, or 55...Kh3, will they make their team-mates change their minds? It's thrilling, the spectators are on the edge of their seats, I think we're about to see another vote...

2014-11-25, 18:05	#5
Brian-E "Brian" Jul 2007 The Netherlands 2·11·149 Posts	[QUOTE=paulunderwood;388394]55... Kh3 leads to Rh5+ and we lose our h pawn. :sad: What do you see gained by 55...Bb4?[/QUOTE] Both 55...Kh3 and 55...Bb4 allow White to mate quickly as I wrote in post #2. I'm just rather facetiously trying to encourage our other two team members to contribute so that we can keep the game moving. But of course they're both busy, I understand that.:smile:

2014-11-25, 18:27	#7
Brian-E "Brian" Jul 2007 The Netherlands 2×11×149 Posts	Yes. My vote is also 55...Ng7. David showed how they then mate us a couple of moves ago, but it's the move which makes it toughest for them, for reasons which you write. Over to David and Rich.

2014-11-25, 18:30	#8
paulunderwood Sep 2002 Database er0rr 5×937 Posts	Maybe there are some alternatives with David's Ng7 line, which we might see as the game progresses. :smile:

2014-11-25, 18:31	#9
Brian-E "Brian" Jul 2007 The Netherlands CCE₁₆ Posts	Yes, maybe, let's hope so.:smile:

2014-11-25, 21:31	#10
henryzz Just call me Henry "David" Sep 2007 Liverpool (GMT/BST) 3×23×89 Posts	Sorry I forgot to post. Ng7 is probably the one to go for. If we were trying to make the game last as long as possible I would go for Be1+ as I haven't seen mate with it yet.

2014-11-27, 01:38	#11
richs "Rich" Aug 2002 Benicia, California 2×859 Posts	Here is Be1+ line: 55. ... Be1+ 56. Kg2 Bxg3 57. hxg3 Nd4 58. Rf4 Kg5 59. Rxf4 Kf6 and we are basically helpless....