Move 46 - Page 2

paulunderwood · 2014-09-21, 06:22

[QUOTE=richs;383589]
Following 46...Bd2 46.Kf3 Nd7,

47. Re6+ Kf8
48. Rd6 Ne5+
49. Ke4 Bc3
and we lose the h pawn?[/QUOTE]

Can we play 46..Bc1?

Brian-E · 2014-09-21, 08:20

[QUOTE=richs;383589]I made it to Italy on Thursday: San Francisco to Frankfurt to Milan, then two trains to Florence.

I had a bit of time to reflect on my h5 suggestion and see that it will not work.

Following 46...Bd2 46.Kf3 Nd7,

47. Re6+ Kf8
48. Rd6 Ne5+
49. Ke4 Bc3
and we lose the h pawn?[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=paulunderwood;383592]Can we play 46..Bc1?[/QUOTE]
We're certainly in danger from lines like Rich's.
Paul's suggestion 46...Bc1 gets my vote now.

henryzz · 2014-09-21, 13:58

[QUOTE=richs;383589]I made it to Italy on Thursday: San Francisco to Frankfurt to Milan, then two trains to Florence.

I had a bit of time to reflect on my h5 suggestion and see that it will not work.

Following 46...Bd2 47.Kf3 Nd7,

48. Re6+ Kf8
49. Rd6 Ne5+
50. Ke4 Bc3
and we lose the h pawn?[/QUOTE]
What happens after 48...Kd8
49.Rd6 Bg5
50.Rd5 We have lost our a pawn
There was faulty numbering in the original quote.

46...Bd2
47.Kf3 Bc1
48.Ke2 Nd7
49.Re6+ Kd8
50.Rc6 Bg5
51.Be6 Ne5
52.Rc5 We have lost our a pawn.

46...Bd2
47.Kf3 Bc1
48.Ke2 Nd7
49.Re6+ Kf8
50.Rc6 Bg5
51.Be6 We have lost our a pawn.

Brian-E · 2014-09-22, 08:59

In response to the lines posted by both Rich and David, I'd like to make the following general remarks:

We have a losing position, we are pretty helpless now, and I don't think we have any miraculous way of avoiding the loss of another pawn. In that case we should just play another waiting move (there's nothing active we can do anyway) and let them work out how they want to convert their overwhelming advantage into a position which we must resign. It's really their responsibility to work that out. There is always the possibility that they will go barking up the wrong tree and give us unexpected new drawing chances.

I would be happy with either 46...Bc1 or 46...Bd2 now.

paulunderwood · 2014-09-22, 09:16

Bc1 followed by Nd7 gets my vote to stop a later fork by White's Rook on our Bishop and Knight. :smile:

Brian-E · 2014-09-22, 11:59

[QUOTE=paulunderwood;383647]Bc1 followed by Nd7 gets my vote to stop a later fork by White's Rook on our Bishop and Knight. :smile:[/QUOTE]
Remembering now why you suggested this in the first place, I concur with you. My vote also goes to 46...Bc1.

Brian-E · 2014-09-24, 09:24

We're down to about 40 hours till the deadline. Shall we all just state, or confirm, what we are voting so that we have time for any last-minute discussion if there is no consensus?

My vote is 46...Bc1.

henryzz · 2014-09-24, 11:35

[QUOTE=Brian-E;383751]
My vote is 46...Bc1.[/QUOTE]
Ditto

paulunderwood · 2014-09-24, 11:47

Ditto

richs · 2014-09-24, 13:16

Agreed.

henryzz · 2014-09-24, 13:54

We all seem to be in agreement. Any objections to posting?

2014-09-21, 06:22	#12
paulunderwood Sep 2002 Database er0rr 124D₁₆ Posts	[QUOTE=richs;383589] Following 46...Bd2 46.Kf3 Nd7, 47. Re6+ Kf8 48. Rd6 Ne5+ 49. Ke4 Bc3 and we lose the h pawn?[/QUOTE] Can we play 46..Bc1? Last fiddled with by paulunderwood on 2014-09-21 at 06:22

2014-09-21, 08:20	#13
Brian-E "Brian" Jul 2007 The Netherlands 2·11·149 Posts	[QUOTE=richs;383589]I made it to Italy on Thursday: San Francisco to Frankfurt to Milan, then two trains to Florence. I had a bit of time to reflect on my h5 suggestion and see that it will not work. Following 46...Bd2 46.Kf3 Nd7, 47. Re6+ Kf8 48. Rd6 Ne5+ 49. Ke4 Bc3 and we lose the h pawn?[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=paulunderwood;383592]Can we play 46..Bc1?[/QUOTE] We're certainly in danger from lines like Rich's. Paul's suggestion 46...Bc1 gets my vote now. Last fiddled with by Brian-E on 2014-09-21 at 08:32 Reason: Deleted some nonsense.

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2014-09-21, 13:58	#14
henryzz Just call me Henry "David" Sep 2007 Liverpool (GMT/BST) 3·23·89 Posts	[QUOTE=richs;383589]I made it to Italy on Thursday: San Francisco to Frankfurt to Milan, then two trains to Florence. I had a bit of time to reflect on my h5 suggestion and see that it will not work. Following 46...Bd2 47.Kf3 Nd7, 48. Re6+ Kf8 49. Rd6 Ne5+ 50. Ke4 Bc3 and we lose the h pawn?[/QUOTE] What happens after 48...Kd8 49.Rd6 Bg5 50.Rd5 We have lost our a pawn There was faulty numbering in the original quote. 46...Bd2 47.Kf3 Bc1 48.Ke2 Nd7 49.Re6+ Kd8 50.Rc6 Bg5 51.Be6 Ne5 52.Rc5 We have lost our a pawn. 46...Bd2 47.Kf3 Bc1 48.Ke2 Nd7 49.Re6+ Kf8 50.Rc6 Bg5 51.Be6 We have lost our a pawn.

2014-09-22, 08:59	#15
Brian-E "Brian" Jul 2007 The Netherlands 2·11·149 Posts	In response to the lines posted by both Rich and David, I'd like to make the following general remarks: We have a losing position, we are pretty helpless now, and I don't think we have any miraculous way of avoiding the loss of another pawn. In that case we should just play another waiting move (there's nothing active we can do anyway) and let them work out how they want to convert their overwhelming advantage into a position which we must resign. It's really their responsibility to work that out. There is always the possibility that they will go barking up the wrong tree and give us unexpected new drawing chances. I would be happy with either 46...Bc1 or 46...Bd2 now.

2014-09-22, 09:16	#16
paulunderwood Sep 2002 Database er0rr 5×937 Posts	Bc1 followed by Nd7 gets my vote to stop a later fork by White's Rook on our Bishop and Knight. :smile:

2014-09-22, 11:59	#17
Brian-E "Brian" Jul 2007 The Netherlands CCE₁₆ Posts	[QUOTE=paulunderwood;383647]Bc1 followed by Nd7 gets my vote to stop a later fork by White's Rook on our Bishop and Knight. :smile:[/QUOTE] Remembering now why you suggested this in the first place, I concur with you. My vote also goes to 46...Bc1.

2014-09-24, 09:24	#18
Brian-E "Brian" Jul 2007 The Netherlands 2×11×149 Posts	We're down to about 40 hours till the deadline. Shall we all just state, or confirm, what we are voting so that we have time for any last-minute discussion if there is no consensus? My vote is 46...Bc1.

2014-09-24, 11:35	#19
henryzz Just call me Henry "David" Sep 2007 Liverpool (GMT/BST) 6141₁₀ Posts	[QUOTE=Brian-E;383751] My vote is 46...Bc1.[/QUOTE] Ditto

2014-09-24, 11:47	#20
paulunderwood Sep 2002 Database er0rr 5×937 Posts	Ditto

2014-09-24, 13:16	#21
richs "Rich" Aug 2002 Benicia, California 2×859 Posts	Agreed.

2014-09-24, 13:54	#22
henryzz Just call me Henry "David" Sep 2007 Liverpool (GMT/BST) 3×23×89 Posts	We all seem to be in agreement. Any objections to posting?