Move 22 - Page 2

Brian-E · 2014-03-08, 17:32

[QUOTE=henryzz;368553]22...f6
23.exf6 Rxf6
24.Re1 bxc3
25.bxc3 e5
26.d5 Nd8[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=richs;368559]Looking at David's f6 line:

22...f6
23.exf6 Rxf6
24.Rxf6 Bxf6 (assuming they take the rook exchange)
25.Ne4 Bg7
26.Nd3 bxc3
27.bxc3 e5
28.dxe5 Nxe5
29.Nd4+ Kf8

and we have two bishops and a knight vs. their two knights and a bishop, and pawns are even.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=paulunderwood;368560]Why not 25.Bxh6...?

Edit: I see now. After exchanges on the diagonal, our Bishop captures their Rook.[/QUOTE]

I don't understand. What am I missing?
Surely 22...f6 23.exf6 Rxf6 24.Rxf6 Bxf6 25.Bxh6 wins the h pawn in addition to the c pawn that will fall. If 25...g5 26.h4.

paulunderwood · 2014-03-08, 19:49

Brian,

22...f6
23.exf6 Rxf6
24.Rxf6 Bxf6
25.Bxh6...

could procede:

26...bxc3
27.bxc3 Nxd4
28 cxd4 Bxd4+ and we have a fork on White's Rook! :smile:

Brian-E · 2014-03-08, 21:32

Thankyou Paul.

Considering that 22...f6 works by this tactical trick, that's definitely my preferred move at the moment. That way we are fighting rather than meekly sitting around and losing the c pawn.

Brian-E · 2014-03-10, 08:26

Let's all keep posting our thoughts if we can. We have a challenge on our hands to salvage a draw, I think, and that may be possible if we get it right.

I still like 22...f6 (now that its tactical trick has been explained to me!). I think we are losing a pawn, for example in Rich's line by (22...f6 23.exf6 Rxf6 24.Rxf6 Bxf6 25.Ne4 Bg7 26.Ne3 bxc3 27.bxc3 e5) [U]28.d5 [/U]Nd8 29.d6 Nec6 30.Nxc4, but various pawns have been exchanged which makes it harder for White to win the ending. If we're losing a pawn anyway, pawn exchanges (plus as much activity as possible) are what we should be striving for.

What are the rest of you currently thinking?

paulunderwood · 2014-03-10, 19:44

An interesting scenario. At the moment, I can not think of a better move than 22...f6. :smile:

Brian-E · 2014-03-11, 10:26

Agreed about the interesting scenario.

Does anyone currently advocate a different move?

Second best in my opinion is 22...Nd5.

But 22...f6 is "getting on with it" by dissolving White's pawn chain. I also have the sneaking hope that they've overlooked it. I certainly did, and the ...Nxd4 trick if they take on f6 and h6 had to be shown to me even after David found the move and the rest of you analysed it, so we could give them a surprise. But that's just the psychological side of the move, and totally irrelevant of course since we only play correct chess, right? :geek:

henryzz · 2014-03-11, 11:33

I would say f6 is what we should go for.

richs · 2014-03-11, 14:31

I totally agree with Brian that we should go out with "guns blazing!" Of the lines I looked at, f6 is my preference.

Brian-E · 2014-03-11, 19:41

Well, with 48 hours to go if we need them, we all seem to agree on the move.

I for one cannot really benefit from any more thinking time, but maybe others can? Or is it time for David to play the move in the interests of making headway in the game?

paulunderwood · 2014-03-11, 19:48

We could make the move now. :smile:

2014-03-08, 17:32	#12
Brian-E "Brian" Jul 2007 The Netherlands CCE₁₆ Posts	[QUOTE=henryzz;368553]22...f6 23.exf6 Rxf6 24.Re1 bxc3 25.bxc3 e5 26.d5 Nd8[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=richs;368559]Looking at David's f6 line: 22...f6 23.exf6 Rxf6 24.Rxf6 Bxf6 (assuming they take the rook exchange) 25.Ne4 Bg7 26.Nd3 bxc3 27.bxc3 e5 28.dxe5 Nxe5 29.Nd4+ Kf8 and we have two bishops and a knight vs. their two knights and a bishop, and pawns are even.[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=paulunderwood;368560]Why not 25.Bxh6...? Edit: I see now. After exchanges on the diagonal, our Bishop captures their Rook.[/QUOTE] I don't understand. What am I missing? Surely 22...f6 23.exf6 Rxf6 24.Rxf6 Bxf6 25.Bxh6 wins the h pawn in addition to the c pawn that will fall. If 25...g5 26.h4. Last fiddled with by Brian-E on 2014-03-08 at 17:44

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2014-03-08, 19:49	#13
paulunderwood Sep 2002 Database er0rr 5×937 Posts	Brian, 22...f6 23.exf6 Rxf6 24.Rxf6 Bxf6 25.Bxh6... could procede: 26...bxc3 27.bxc3 Nxd4 28 cxd4 Bxd4+ and we have a fork on White's Rook! :smile:

2014-03-08, 21:32	#14
Brian-E "Brian" Jul 2007 The Netherlands 2·11·149 Posts	Thankyou Paul. Considering that 22...f6 works by this tactical trick, that's definitely my preferred move at the moment. That way we are fighting rather than meekly sitting around and losing the c pawn.

2014-03-10, 08:26	#15
Brian-E "Brian" Jul 2007 The Netherlands 2×11×149 Posts	Let's all keep posting our thoughts if we can. We have a challenge on our hands to salvage a draw, I think, and that may be possible if we get it right. I still like 22...f6 (now that its tactical trick has been explained to me!). I think we are losing a pawn, for example in Rich's line by (22...f6 23.exf6 Rxf6 24.Rxf6 Bxf6 25.Ne4 Bg7 26.Ne3 bxc3 27.bxc3 e5) [U]28.d5 [/U]Nd8 29.d6 Nec6 30.Nxc4, but various pawns have been exchanged which makes it harder for White to win the ending. If we're losing a pawn anyway, pawn exchanges (plus as much activity as possible) are what we should be striving for. What are the rest of you currently thinking?

2014-03-10, 19:44	#16
paulunderwood Sep 2002 Database er0rr 5×937 Posts	An interesting scenario. At the moment, I can not think of a better move than 22...f6. :smile:

2014-03-11, 10:26	#17
Brian-E "Brian" Jul 2007 The Netherlands 2×11×149 Posts	Agreed about the interesting scenario. Does anyone currently advocate a different move? Second best in my opinion is 22...Nd5. But 22...f6 is "getting on with it" by dissolving White's pawn chain. I also have the sneaking hope that they've overlooked it. I certainly did, and the ...Nxd4 trick if they take on f6 and h6 had to be shown to me even after David found the move and the rest of you analysed it, so we could give them a surprise. But that's just the psychological side of the move, and totally irrelevant of course since we only play correct chess, right? :geek:

2014-03-11, 11:33	#18
henryzz Just call me Henry "David" Sep 2007 Liverpool (GMT/BST) 3×23×89 Posts	I would say f6 is what we should go for.

2014-03-11, 14:31	#19
richs "Rich" Aug 2002 Benicia, California 2×859 Posts	I totally agree with Brian that we should go out with "guns blazing!" Of the lines I looked at, f6 is my preference.

2014-03-11, 19:41	#20
Brian-E "Brian" Jul 2007 The Netherlands 6316₈ Posts	Well, with 48 hours to go if we need them, we all seem to agree on the move. I for one cannot really benefit from any more thinking time, but maybe others can? Or is it time for David to play the move in the interests of making headway in the game?

2014-03-11, 19:48	#21
paulunderwood Sep 2002 Database er0rr 5·937 Posts	We could make the move now. :smile: