Move 3

Brian-E · 2013-08-07, 11:03

Well, surprise!

I guess that with the move 3.g3 they are now committed to a Closed Sicilian opening. The move g3 is pretty innocuous in open lines. My hunch that they might try to trick us seems to have been unfounded.

I'm really pleased to see their move. I was a bit nervous of going down some highly theoretical route in a mainstream Sicilian line and finding myself out of my depth even if the rest of you would have been comfortable playing like that. The Closed Sicilian leads to a more positional type of game where planning is more important than exact move order. That's not to say it's not dangerous for Black: it [I]is[/I] dangerous if we play too passively or without a coherent plan. But we're not going to do that, are we?:smile:

So what are our options now? 3...g6 is very natural because g7, on the long diagonal, is clearly an excellent posting for our bishop, whereas the g8 knight could be developed to either f6 or e7 at a later point where we have seen more of what their intentions are. But there are other good moves for us now too, such as 3...Nf6, 3...d6 and 3...e6, and others. What is everyone's preference?

paulunderwood · 2013-08-07, 16:15

Let's take our time. 3...g6 is mirroring the last game, but this does not make it a bad move. We need some kingside devlopment

They will be pushing pawns forward on the kings side in a few moves.

One option is to fianchetto our white square bishop on the queens's side to attack their king when they castle on the king's side.

e5 by us will help to stem the pawn invasion and covers our pawn on c5, but leaves d5 open for their knight to advance.

e7-e6 by us will help a possible d7-d5 by us, and help to defend an attack on f7.

henryzz · 2013-08-08, 15:02

I think I agree with g6. The only reason to avoid it would be to try to leave theory. It is quite a reasonable move.

paulunderwood · 2013-08-08, 16:06

g6 is a fine move. Are we agreed?

henryzz · 2013-08-08, 16:27

Do we want to be the team that first deviates from the first game? Because of discussion there are a few points in our play last game that they now know how to improve on. If we see a good point to change the game(two equal moves) I think we should choose the other one.
As we are in no rush we will wait for Brian. We could actually wait for rich if we wanted as he is back in a couple of days(don't see the point for this move)

paulunderwood · 2013-08-08, 16:47

A good idea: let's await rich's return. :smile:

Brian-E · 2013-08-08, 18:56

I, too, think that 3...g6 is the best. It keeps more of our options open than other moves do, I think.

As for waiting for Rich: he actually said that he's away until 15 August (or have I missed a more recent correction to that?). This date is, unfortunately, slightly too late because we need play our move before approximately 12.00 GMT on 14 August.

Still, there's something to be said for hanging back a bit for Rich's sake. It would be very nice to let him give input for move 4, and our opponents might play their 4th move quickly (4.Bg2 would be pretty obvious). So shall we slow things down a little, even if Rich is not part of this move?

henryzz · 2013-08-08, 19:16

I was sure I saw the 10th somewhere.
You lose me on the 15th until the 24th. TBH I think the next 2 moves are pretty obvious. Bg2 and then probably Bg7. You could quite possibly guess at something like d3 followed by d6 after that.
I am perfectly willing to follow the standard line of the closed sicillian like we did last time. It is later on that the differences will start. I think it would be nice if it wasn't just them correcting our mistakes in the last game though.

Brian-E · 2013-08-08, 21:00

About following the last game: I'd be quite surprised if we end up doing that right up to the first demonstrable error (13.g4?). Both sides played various idiosyncratic, non-obvious moves before that, and even if our opponents choose to try and repeat the game up until our error, there's no reason at all why we should have to do that too. So, in my opinion, we should just play natural developing moves without worrying particularly about the last game for the time being.

About the absences: perhaps we should try to engineer it so that we hope to receive our opponents' 4th move on or around 12/13 August. That way both David and Rich get to give some input in our 4th move, though not, unfortunately, at the same time. That, of course, requires guessing how long they're going to spend on their move, and that's easier said than done. We could maybe play our move 3...g6 on around 9/10 August, expecting them to take about 3 days? Perhaps?:smile:

Brian-E · 2013-08-09, 20:09

So what do you both think? Is playing 3...g6 about now the right decision? Or should we hold off?

paulunderwood · 2013-08-09, 20:52

3...g6 is fine by me. :smile:

2013-08-07, 11:03	#1
Brian-E "Brian" Jul 2007 The Netherlands 2·11·149 Posts	Move 3 Well, surprise! I guess that with the move 3.g3 they are now committed to a Closed Sicilian opening. The move g3 is pretty innocuous in open lines. My hunch that they might try to trick us seems to have been unfounded. I'm really pleased to see their move. I was a bit nervous of going down some highly theoretical route in a mainstream Sicilian line and finding myself out of my depth even if the rest of you would have been comfortable playing like that. The Closed Sicilian leads to a more positional type of game where planning is more important than exact move order. That's not to say it's not dangerous for Black: it [I]is[/I] dangerous if we play too passively or without a coherent plan. But we're not going to do that, are we?:smile: So what are our options now? 3...g6 is very natural because g7, on the long diagonal, is clearly an excellent posting for our bishop, whereas the g8 knight could be developed to either f6 or e7 at a later point where we have seen more of what their intentions are. But there are other good moves for us now too, such as 3...Nf6, 3...d6 and 3...e6, and others. What is everyone's preference?

2013-08-07, 16:15	#2
paulunderwood Sep 2002 Database er0rr 11115₈ Posts	Let's take our time. 3...g6 is mirroring the last game, but this does not make it a bad move. We need some kingside devlopment They will be pushing pawns forward on the kings side in a few moves. One option is to fianchetto our white square bishop on the queens's side to attack their king when they castle on the king's side. e5 by us will help to stem the pawn invasion and covers our pawn on c5, but leaves d5 open for their knight to advance. e7-e6 by us will help a possible d7-d5 by us, and help to defend an attack on f7. Last fiddled with by paulunderwood on 2013-08-07 at 16:19

2013-08-08, 21:00	#9
Brian-E "Brian" Jul 2007 The Netherlands 2×11×149 Posts	About following the last game: I'd be quite surprised if we end up doing that right up to the first demonstrable error (13.g4?). Both sides played various idiosyncratic, non-obvious moves before that, and even if our opponents choose to try and repeat the game up until our error, there's no reason at all why we should have to do that too. So, in my opinion, we should just play natural developing moves without worrying particularly about the last game for the time being. About the absences: perhaps we should try to engineer it so that we hope to receive our opponents' 4th move on or around 12/13 August. That way both David and Rich get to give some input in our 4th move, though not, unfortunately, at the same time. That, of course, requires guessing how long they're going to spend on their move, and that's easier said than done. We could maybe play our move 3...g6 on around 9/10 August, expecting them to take about 3 days? Perhaps?:smile: Last fiddled with by Brian-E on 2013-08-08 at 21:03 Reason: punctuation

2013-08-09, 20:09	#10
Brian-E "Brian" Jul 2007 The Netherlands 2·11·149 Posts	So what do you both think? Is playing 3...g6 about now the right decision? Or should we hold off? Last fiddled with by Brian-E on 2013-08-09 at 20:09

2013-08-09, 20:52	#11
paulunderwood Sep 2002 Database er0rr 5×937 Posts	3...g6 is fine by me. :smile: Last fiddled with by paulunderwood on 2013-08-09 at 20:53

2013-08-08, 15:02	#3
henryzz Just call me Henry "David" Sep 2007 Liverpool (GMT/BST) 3·23·89 Posts	I think I agree with g6. The only reason to avoid it would be to try to leave theory. It is quite a reasonable move.

2013-08-08, 16:06	#4
paulunderwood Sep 2002 Database er0rr 5·937 Posts	g6 is a fine move. Are we agreed?

2013-08-08, 16:27	#5
henryzz Just call me Henry "David" Sep 2007 Liverpool (GMT/BST) 3×23×89 Posts	Do we want to be the team that first deviates from the first game? Because of discussion there are a few points in our play last game that they now know how to improve on. If we see a good point to change the game(two equal moves) I think we should choose the other one. As we are in no rush we will wait for Brian. We could actually wait for rich if we wanted as he is back in a couple of days(don't see the point for this move)

2013-08-08, 16:47	#6
paulunderwood Sep 2002 Database er0rr 5×937 Posts	A good idea: let's await rich's return. :smile:

2013-08-08, 18:56	#7
Brian-E "Brian" Jul 2007 The Netherlands CCE₁₆ Posts	I, too, think that 3...g6 is the best. It keeps more of our options open than other moves do, I think. As for waiting for Rich: he actually said that he's away until 15 August (or have I missed a more recent correction to that?). This date is, unfortunately, slightly too late because we need play our move before approximately 12.00 GMT on 14 August. Still, there's something to be said for hanging back a bit for Rich's sake. It would be very nice to let him give input for move 4, and our opponents might play their 4th move quickly (4.Bg2 would be pretty obvious). So shall we slow things down a little, even if Rich is not part of this move?

2013-08-08, 19:16	#8
henryzz Just call me Henry "David" Sep 2007 Liverpool (GMT/BST) 3×23×89 Posts	I was sure I saw the 10th somewhere. You lose me on the 15th until the 24th. TBH I think the next 2 moves are pretty obvious. Bg2 and then probably Bg7. You could quite possibly guess at something like d3 followed by d6 after that. I am perfectly willing to follow the standard line of the closed sicillian like we did last time. It is later on that the differences will start. I think it would be nice if it wasn't just them correcting our mistakes in the last game though.

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