Move 18 - Page 2

henryzz · 2013-02-02, 21:31

I think that is what we need to play. We need to keep trying to find a good way out of the pickle we are in.

henryzz · 2013-02-02, 21:46

How about:
18. Qc2 exd4
19. Rbd1 Nd5
20. Qxd4

Zeta-Flux · 2013-02-02, 21:47

Alternatively,

18. Qc2 dxe4 (I've had e and d backwards for some reason) henryzz: lol I copied bits from you and never noticed
19. Rbd1 Nd5
20. Qxe4 Nxe3
21. Qxe3 and we seem to be in a strong position.

if instead
20. ... Nxf4?
21. Qxb7

Zeta-Flux · 2013-02-02, 21:48

Looks like henryzz and I are on the same page. Those moves look very good to me.

Brian-E · 2013-02-02, 21:53

Zeta-Flux, I think you've found a much better plan, playing a rook to d1 before we recapture the pawn on e4.

The line you give starting 18.Qc2 dxe4 19.Rbd1 Nd5 allows us to play 20.Qxe4! and I think we're winning material. We are threatening Rxd5 winning two pieces for a rook, and their tactical trick 20...Nxc3 doesn't seem to work after 21.Qxb7 Nxe2+ 22.Bxe2 with an extra piece.

This looks much better!

EDIT: just previewed post and seen that you two have also found 20.Qxe4!

henryzz · 2013-02-02, 21:55

[QUOTE=Zeta-Flux;327235]Looks like henryzz and I are on the same page. Those moves look very good to me.[/QUOTE]

In comparison at least. I am going to put together a post with all our best move sequences in. I will be editing it as I go along so you can see what I am doing and maybe make suggestions if necessary.

henryzz · 2013-02-02, 21:58

18. Qc2 dxe4[LIST][*]19. Bxe4[LIST][*]Bxe4 20. Qxe4 Qd3(maybe Qd5 an option?) 21. Ng3[*]Nd5[LIST][*]20. Rbd1[LIST][*]exf4[LIST][*]20. Bxf4[*]20. Bxd5+ Bxd5 21. Bxf4[/LIST][*]Nxe3 20. Rxd8[LIST][*]R(af)xd8 21. Q(bc)1 Nxf1 22. Bxb7 Nd2[*]Nxc2[LIST][*]21. Rxf8+ (BR)xf8 22. Bxb7[*]21. Rxa8 Bxe4[LIST][*]22. Rxa7[*]22. Rxf8+Bxf8[/LIST][/LIST][/LIST][/LIST][*]20. Rfd1 Nxe3[LIST][*]21. Qc1 Bxe4 22. Qxe3 Bxb1[*]21. Qa4 Bxe4[/LIST][*]20. Bc1[*]20. Bd2[/LIST][*]Q(cd)7[/LIST][*]19. Rbd1[LIST][*]exf3 looks horrible[*]Nd5[LIST][*]20. Qxe4 [LIST][*]Nxe3 21. Qxe3[*]Nxf4 21. Qxb7[/LIST][*]20. Bxe4[LIST][*]exf4[LIST][*]20. Bxf4[*]20. Bxd5+ Bxd5 21. Bxf4[/LIST][*]Nxe3 20. Rxd8[LIST][*]R(af)xd8 21. Q(bc)1 Nxf1 22. Bxb7 Nd2[*]Nxc2[LIST][*]21. Rxf8+ (BR)xf8 22. Bxb7[*]21. Rxa8 Bxe4[LIST][*]22. Rxa7[*]22. Rxf8+Bxf8[/LIST][/LIST][/LIST][/LIST][/LIST][*]Bd5[*]Qc(78) defending bishop and moving queen[/LIST][*]19. Rfd1[LIST][*]exf3 looks horrible[*]Nd5[LIST][*]20. Qxe4 [LIST][*]Nxe3 21. Qxe3[*]Nxf4 21. Qxb7[/LIST][*]20. Bxe4[LIST][*]exf4[LIST][*]20. Bxf4[*]20. Bxd5+ Bxd5 21. Bxf4[/LIST][*]Nxe3 20. Rxd8[LIST][*]R(af)xd8 21. Qc1 Bxe4[*]Nxc2[LIST][*]21. Rxf8+ (BR)xf8 22. Bxb7[*]21. Rxa8 Bxe4[LIST][*]22. Rxa7[*]22. Rxf8+Bxf8[/LIST][/LIST][/LIST][/LIST][/LIST][*]Bd5[*]Qc(78) defending bishop and moving queen[/LIST][/LIST]

Brian-E · 2013-02-02, 22:04

[QUOTE=Zeta-Flux;327234]Alternatively,

18. Qc2 dxe4 (I've had e and d backwards for some reason) henryzz: lol I copied bits from you and never noticed
19. Rbd1 Nd5
20. Qxe4 Nxe3
21. Qxe3 and we seem to be in a strong position.

if instead
20. ... Nxf4?
21. Qxb7[/QUOTE]
Yes, you're right, they'll play 20...Nxe3 and we're not winning material exactly, as I erroneously stated before, but it's indeed a fine position for us.

henryzz · 2013-02-02, 23:37

How do we respond to 18. Qc2 dxe4 19. R(bf)d1 exf3 ?
That looks like a horrible position to have a passed pawn in.

Zeta-Flux · 2013-02-02, 23:56

If you mean exf4, don't we simply take their queen with our rook? To make up material they then have to sacrifice their passed pawns.

richs · 2013-02-03, 03:48

I have to digest this all... May not be until Monday, sorry. Committed to a Super Bowl party on Sunday.

2013-02-02, 21:47	#14
Zeta-Flux May 2003 7·13·17 Posts	Alternatively, 18. Qc2 dxe4 (I've had e and d backwards for some reason) henryzz: lol I copied bits from you and never noticed 19. Rbd1 Nd5 20. Qxe4 Nxe3 21. Qxe3 and we seem to be in a strong position. if instead 20. ... Nxf4? 21. Qxb7 Last fiddled with by henryzz on 2013-02-02 at 21:50

2013-02-02, 21:58	#18
henryzz Just call me Henry "David" Sep 2007 Liverpool (GMT/BST) 3×23×89 Posts	18. Qc2 dxe4[LIST][]19. Bxe4[LIST][]Bxe4 20. Qxe4 Qd3(maybe Qd5 an option?) 21. Ng3[]Nd5[LIST][]20. Rbd1[LIST][]exf4[LIST][]20. Bxf4[]20. Bxd5+ Bxd5 21. Bxf4[/LIST][]Nxe3 20. Rxd8[LIST][]R(af)xd8 21. Q(bc)1 Nxf1 22. Bxb7 Nd2[]Nxc2[LIST][]21. Rxf8+ (BR)xf8 22. Bxb7[]21. Rxa8 Bxe4[LIST][]22. Rxa7[]22. Rxf8+Bxf8[/LIST][/LIST][/LIST][/LIST][]20. Rfd1 Nxe3[LIST][]21. Qc1 Bxe4 22. Qxe3 Bxb1[]21. Qa4 Bxe4[/LIST][]20. Bc1[]20. Bd2[/LIST][]Q(cd)7[/LIST][]19. Rbd1[LIST][]exf3 looks horrible[]Nd5[LIST][]20. Qxe4 [LIST][]Nxe3 21. Qxe3[]Nxf4 21. Qxb7[/LIST][]20. Bxe4[LIST][]exf4[LIST][]20. Bxf4[]20. Bxd5+ Bxd5 21. Bxf4[/LIST][]Nxe3 20. Rxd8[LIST][]R(af)xd8 21. Q(bc)1 Nxf1 22. Bxb7 Nd2[]Nxc2[LIST][]21. Rxf8+ (BR)xf8 22. Bxb7[]21. Rxa8 Bxe4[LIST][]22. Rxa7[]22. Rxf8+Bxf8[/LIST][/LIST][/LIST][/LIST][/LIST][]Bd5[]Qc(78) defending bishop and moving queen[/LIST][]19. Rfd1[LIST][]exf3 looks horrible[]Nd5[LIST][]20. Qxe4 [LIST][]Nxe3 21. Qxe3[]Nxf4 21. Qxb7[/LIST][]20. Bxe4[LIST][]exf4[LIST][]20. Bxf4[]20. Bxd5+ Bxd5 21. Bxf4[/LIST][]Nxe3 20. Rxd8[LIST][]R(af)xd8 21. Qc1 Bxe4[]Nxc2[LIST][]21. Rxf8+ (BR)xf8 22. Bxb7[]21. Rxa8 Bxe4[LIST][]22. Rxa7[]22. Rxf8+Bxf8[/LIST][/LIST][/LIST][/LIST][/LIST][]Bd5[]Qc(78) defending bishop and moving queen[/LIST][/LIST] Last fiddled with by henryzz on 2013-02-03 at 17:11

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2013-02-02, 21:31	#12
henryzz Just call me Henry "David" Sep 2007 Liverpool (GMT/BST) 17FD₁₆ Posts	I think that is what we need to play. We need to keep trying to find a good way out of the pickle we are in.

2013-02-02, 21:46	#13
henryzz Just call me Henry "David" Sep 2007 Liverpool (GMT/BST) 17FD₁₆ Posts	How about: 18. Qc2 exd4 19. Rbd1 Nd5 20. Qxd4

2013-02-02, 21:48	#15
Zeta-Flux May 2003 1547₁₀ Posts	Looks like henryzz and I are on the same page. Those moves look very good to me.

2013-02-02, 21:53	#16
Brian-E "Brian" Jul 2007 The Netherlands 2·11·149 Posts	Zeta-Flux, I think you've found a much better plan, playing a rook to d1 before we recapture the pawn on e4. The line you give starting 18.Qc2 dxe4 19.Rbd1 Nd5 allows us to play 20.Qxe4! and I think we're winning material. We are threatening Rxd5 winning two pieces for a rook, and their tactical trick 20...Nxc3 doesn't seem to work after 21.Qxb7 Nxe2+ 22.Bxe2 with an extra piece. This looks much better! EDIT: just previewed post and seen that you two have also found 20.Qxe4!

2013-02-02, 21:55	#17
henryzz Just call me Henry "David" Sep 2007 Liverpool (GMT/BST) 3·23·89 Posts	[QUOTE=Zeta-Flux;327235]Looks like henryzz and I are on the same page. Those moves look very good to me.[/QUOTE] In comparison at least. I am going to put together a post with all our best move sequences in. I will be editing it as I go along so you can see what I am doing and maybe make suggestions if necessary.

2013-02-02, 22:04	#19
Brian-E "Brian" Jul 2007 The Netherlands 2·11·149 Posts	[QUOTE=Zeta-Flux;327234]Alternatively, 18. Qc2 dxe4 (I've had e and d backwards for some reason) henryzz: lol I copied bits from you and never noticed 19. Rbd1 Nd5 20. Qxe4 Nxe3 21. Qxe3 and we seem to be in a strong position. if instead 20. ... Nxf4? 21. Qxb7[/QUOTE] Yes, you're right, they'll play 20...Nxe3 and we're not winning material exactly, as I erroneously stated before, but it's indeed a fine position for us.

2013-02-02, 23:37	#20
henryzz Just call me Henry "David" Sep 2007 Liverpool (GMT/BST) 6141₁₀ Posts	How do we respond to 18. Qc2 dxe4 19. R(bf)d1 exf3 ? That looks like a horrible position to have a passed pawn in.

2013-02-02, 23:56	#21
Zeta-Flux May 2003 7×13×17 Posts	If you mean exf4, don't we simply take their queen with our rook? To make up material they then have to sacrifice their passed pawns.

2013-02-03, 03:48	#22
richs "Rich" Aug 2002 Benicia, California 1718₁₀ Posts	I have to digest this all... May not be until Monday, sorry. Committed to a Super Bowl party on Sunday.