Move 13

[Xyzzy]

if he was actually viewing this forum he couldn't help but use the info in it to make statements/decisions in the other forum

i still think he is just doing his weird post count thing

but i could be wrong

the passwords are pretty secure and i don't think any of you left your session open in the library

even still, he isn't playing nice

i suppose you all could post real mean stuff about him and then he would complain

then we'd know for sure

[Xyzzy]

Last Activity: 27 Dec 12 15:18
Current Activity: Viewing Who Posted Move 13

[Brian-E]

Hmm, okay.

For those that haven't noticed the "weird post count thing", it was first observed when Raman [URL="http://www.mersenneforum.org/showpost.php?p=321019&postcount=141"]openly gave[/URL] the correct number of posts by each member of the Toxic Geckos in our most recent thread at the time.

I'm happy to assume that that's all he's doing unless and until we see any evidence to the contrary.

Shall we get back to discussing the position?:smile:

[richs]

Sorry for my delayed response; having a dental issue....

I do not think that we should proceed with a kingside attack. Our position is much more amenable to a queenside attack based on my earlier analyses. I still like c3 as our next move. I will post more on my opinion tomorrow once the penicillin kicks in.

P.S. And I was wondering why Brian had our password changed. Intuition about Raman?

[Brian-E]

Sorry to hear about your dental problem, Rich, and I hope it clears up quickly.

Let's hear more about the prospects for attacking on the queenside when you are feeling better. And from David too, who also advocates a queenside attack albeit with 13.c4 rather than 13.c3.

And about the password change: yes, it was in response to seeing Raman's post in the public vote chess thread to which I linked above. Perhaps I should have shared my concerns with all of us at the time. I wasn't particularly meaning to keep things back from the rest of the team: rather, I hoped it wasn't very important and didn't want to cause any possible upset unnecessarily.

[henryzz]

Looking back I am not quite sure why I suggested c4 over c3. Maybe the inspiration will come back. I still think a queen side attack or trying to knock off his c pawn such that we can do a central attack.

[Zeta-Flux]

Currently, our biggest advantage seems to be that we have room to maneuver, and black is on the defensive. He traded off his one attacking piece. He is especially cramped on the kingside. He enjoys more room on the queenside, but has not yet developed his pieces over there. His white bishop is, in my opinion, especially ill-placed.

I want to keep black on the defensive, and in his cramped position. The best way to do that is start an offensive on the king side, developing our knight to help. A queenside attack will work to their single advantage; room on the queenside to maneuver. So I still prefer a kingside advance with g4.

[richs]

If we go with 13. g4, here is what I think will follow: 13. ... f5 14. exf5 Bxf3 15. Rxf3 exf5 16. g5 and we are down a pawn.

Here is my alternate line: 13. c3 f5 14. g4 fxe4 15. dxe4 d5 16. Qc2 and we have a hot contest in the middle.

[Brian-E]

[QUOTE=richs;322950]If we go with 13. g4, here is what I think will follow: 13. ... f5 14. exf5 Bxf3 15. Rxf3 exf5 16. g5 and we are down a pawn.

Here is my alternate line: 13. c3 f5 14. g4 fxe4 15. dxe4 d5 16. Qc2 and we have a hot contest in the middle.[/QUOTE]
At the end of your first line material looks level to me, not a pawn down for us, but I prefer 14.g5 to 14.exf5 in any case. See the line I give in post #5.

In your second line I think 13.c3 f5 14.g4 is dubious because of the reply 14....fxg4 after which our castled king's position is opened and I think Black has as much prospect of attacking our king as we have of attacking theirs.

The reason I advocate 13.g4 immediately is so that we can answer ...f5 with g5.

By the way, I think playing the move c3 will be desirable soon as well, even necessary to free up our rook on b1 from its passive defence of b2. But 13...f5, the reply you suggest Rich, is indeed a good reply to 13.c3 and it damages our attacking chances.

I agree with Zeta-Flux' latest comments and feel that we are justified in attacking on the kingside because of one or two rather passive moves made by Black. I think we have an advantage, but we need to play positively and aggressively to capitalise on it. That advantage is in space on the kingside. On the queenside, in contrast, Black is solid, and I see nothing to attack there. In fact opening up the queenside (if that is the aim) is to our disadvantage because of Black's pressure with the g7 bishop and potential control of invasion points for major pieces on b2 and a1. (This last paragraph is mainly in answer to henryzz' comments.)

[Zeta-Flux]

Like Brian-E, after 13. g4 f5, I favor 14. g5.

It locks in the black king, and we now have our queen and bishop lined up on h5. Our knight will soon join the attack, as well as our h-pawn

[henryzz]

Looks to me like everyone is agreeing with g4 then.