LLRnet/PRPnet rally August 12th-19th - Page 8

mdettweiler · 2010-08-23, 04:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lennart

Most server is on a Windows server. Then we have 2 server on a second Winserver and 5 server on a Ubuntu server + 2 here at my home also on Ubuntu.

I have seen the problem one time, It was on the Ubuntu server. The thing was that I had to little memory ( only 2G ) I have added 2 more and now it works ok with 4G.

I thought the problem was the memory necause when I upgraded to 4G I have never seen it happen anymore.

Lennart

That would seem to be consistent, then, with the behavior we're seeing. Our server machine has 4 GB of RAM, but it was also under the very heavy load of a rally with relatively small (well, at least compared to some of the servers you're running

) n=~900K base 2 candidates. I've never seen this happen outside of a rally, so my guess is that the volume of the memory leak is correlated to the # of pair processed.

mdettweiler · 2010-09-01, 07:04

Considering as how we're now just getting into September, we should probably get started planning the next rally. We usually try to keep them at least a month apart, so anything from the 4th week of September on is fair game.

One other thing to consider: how long do we want the next one to be? IMO the 7 day rally was great fun and gave everyone sufficient time to plot takeovers and other kinds of action within the rally rankings; the shorter 48-hour rallies were over so fast that the rankings outcome was mostly predetermined at the start. I'd be in favor of doing another 7 day one, though if others would prefer shorter or longer(!), we're certainly open to suggestions.

Of note, PrimeGrid's next rally is from Friday, September 24, to Thursday, October 8 (13 days long--AFAIK this is their biggest yet). We could do ours so that it finishes the day before like last time, but I wouldn't recommend doing ours directly after PrimeGrid's--theirs will be on PSP numbers this time, which are very, very large and can take more than 4 days apiece, so there will likely be an extended "cleanup period" following the rally.

vaughan · 2010-09-01, 08:33

I liked the recent 7 day rally. It was long enough to switch over the pharm and to get some performance tweaks done (ie I managed to get at least one box running the faster application :) )

I agree we should plan it so as not to clash with a major BOINC project or we will struggle for participants.

henryzz · 2010-09-01, 12:48

Is there any way we can pursuade free-dc to join us for a week rally? Like offering to run one of their rallies. That amount of competition would be awesome.

mdettweiler · 2010-09-01, 17:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by henryzz

Is there any way we can pursuade free-dc to join us for a week rally? Like offering to run one of their rallies. That amount of competition would be awesome.

It would--but are they even doing rallies any more? I just checked their forum and their prime search project looks...well, dead. The last post in their forum was way back in June, and from my observation of the top-5000 it seemed that even up until then it was just PCZ cranking out primes here and there.

Nonetheless, according to their stats site, they are still cranking out a decent ~8000 pairs/day on n=~690K numbers--and it's not just PCZ. So I'm not really sure what's going on there. It's possible those cores are just misnamed members of PCZ's own farm; a quick peruse of their user stats shows that they don't seem to be too interested in correcting those by redirecting them to the correct username. (There's close to 10 entries there for Beyond alone.)

We have posted rally announcements in the NPLB subforum at Free-DC each time, but alas without any response. What you propose is an interesting idea, though. Given that PCZ doesn't even seem to be reporting primes in their forum any more, I'd guess that's not the place to reach him; email might work.

kar_bon · 2010-09-01, 23:11

Seems quite right!

PCZ is crunching alone (4 other 'users' got almost the same amout in pairs/points; perhaps a quad left alone).

'Free-DC' is only PCZ for a longer time now, he's reporting almost every day new primes of that 3rd drive (k=6000-7000) from about n=480 at the beginning to 670k, then just jumping to 700k-710k, back to 670k and now at n=690.

So I think no response for our next rally. PCZ only wants to hold his first place in primefinding!

gd_barnes · 2010-09-02, 20:06

I can't help but think that David was referring to Free-DC in general. Not just the searchers on the Free-DC prime seach project. IMHO, that project was set up as a direct competitor to NPLB and RPS so we are unlikely to see any of their searchers here. In other words, could we persuade Lauren or other Free-DCers who only search for primes occassionally to join our rally? That is the big question. Since we've posted our rallies there with no success, I think it would take some Emails being sent to such individuals personally. I was able to get Beyond (Jamers) to put a quad or two on a couple of rallies by sending him an Email but I suspect he has lost access or has very limited access to many of his machines since he rarely searches anymore.

One more thing: Has Free-DC prime search even ever had a rally? I haven't personally seen one. There's no way that we could offer to run one of theirs if they don't have them! :-)

AMDave · 2010-09-08, 15:21

<I just cut out several paragraphs here..the remainder is much more curt, concise and constructive>

This thread is well off topic.

I am taking issue with the speculations' in last few posts in this thread. If you 'think but are not sure of something' then ask the person who knows the answer. Personally.

@gary "I can't help but think that David was referring to" - caution on inflamatory speculation, there is a written record. No. You are blurring two lines. I can tell you you (relating to your 'gist') that the main issues were with platform stability, access stability and port & range stability - those were the main reasons that FDCPS was funded and formed. Since then they have committed will to large ranges on a small number of ports as they specified and have not wavered. Their numbers are impressive.

If you have a port that matches theirs in stability and bandwidth then throw down the gauntlet! Email them. PM them. Get on the phone. Don't sit at the bar chatting about 'what-if'. Make the sparks fly!

"suspect he has lost access or has very limited access to many of his machines" No. I don't believe that for a nano-second as you will find hin all over the place, if you know where to look.
"since he rarely searches anymore." - now that part may be true. You should ask him about that.

@karsten "PCZ only wants to hold his first place in primefinding! " so would many many many many other people. But you have got to respect the fact that they earned that place to start with, yes?

mdettweiler · 2010-09-08, 15:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by AMDave

<I just cut out several paragraphs here..the remainder is much more curt, concise and constructive>

Dudes!

This thread is well off topic.

I am taking issue with the speculations' in last few posts in this thread. If you 'think but are not sure of something' then ask the person who knows the answer. Personally.

David' referred to several things at different times for different reasons. If you are not sure what he meant, ask him. If you wish I can clarify your thoughts. I have all of the PM's, emails and posts a nd even IRC logs.

However, I can tell you you (relating to your 'gist') that the main issues were with platform stability, access stability and port & range stability - those were the main reasons that FDCPS was funded and formed. Since then they have committed will to large ranges on a small number of ports as they specified and have not wavered. Their numbers are impressive.

If you have a port that matches theirs in stability and bandwidth then throw down the gauntlet! Email them. PM them. Get on the phone. Don't sit at the bar chatting about 'what-if'. Make the sparks fly!

...but please try not to speculate about other people's thoughts or intentions in public forums without involving them in the discussion. It makes *me* feel dirty when I read it, because I was there and so were you, but I remember it all very very clearly.

Indeed, agreed--but I must say, looking at their stats page, I only see PCZ crunching actively there (along with a few other "users" that appear to be misnamed machines of his). I suppose that can still constitute a project, though. At any rate, it's worth a try to contact him and see what he thinks.

BTW: The "David" Gary referred to is henryzz (it's a long story), not IronBits. That might clarify things a little.

AMDave · 2010-09-08, 16:03

re which "David" - clear as mud.
henryzz would have eliminated any possibility of confusion.
There are and have been several people called "David" (and hopefully many more)
Referring to conversations without clear reference is always going to lead to misunderstanding.
Speculative posts are always going to illicit a response.
I was always going to respond and there was always a very high chance of being irrelevant.

(Hence why I often regret joining these chit chats in this forum)

/ed - my other comments stand
I still think you guys should use your PM's vs posts more selectively.

NPLB needs a marketing plan to get it to where you want it to be.
I know what I think it should be.
Do you know what you think it should be?

As I see it, marketing chats is one of those thought processes that should not be a thread but in PM or email when in prep.
That is not just an opinion - there are very valid reasons for that.
Those reasons need to be taken more seriously if you want the project to pursue the directions that you desire per the forum.
This project can easily get there, but for a few decisions and actions.

my 2c

-ed/

gd_barnes · 2010-09-08, 20:02

Whoa AMDave. Like Max said, I was responding to Henryzz's comments, not anything you ever said. There are way too many Dave's and David's around. Also like I said, we've posted our rallies at Free-DC many times in a row. No response.

I'm not a marketer. The concept is lost on me and I don't particularly enjoy it. I don't like sales. :-) That is a big reason why I asked Max to be a co-admin of the project when it started. He has done a good job of posting our rallies here and there and keeping up with what is going on in other projects. When he plugged our last rally at PrimeGrid, he sent out the PMs that you are talking about to make sure it was OK to do so. I suppose that just a few appropriately sent Emails or PMs to the correct large searchers might help. I've sent them to Beyond, Lennart, and a couple of others at various times. I don't know if Lauren still searches but I still have his Email from when he ran the rallies with us. Perhaps I'll send him one for the next rally.

I guess what I/we are looking for here are some "regulars". People who come around and stay like Vaughan has done.

Why don't you enlighten us on what you think our marketing plan should be? You can send Max or me a PM if you would like.

Gary

2010-09-02, 20:06	#84
gd_barnes May 2007 Kansas; USA 3³×5×7×11 Posts	I can't help but think that David was referring to Free-DC in general. Not just the searchers on the Free-DC prime seach project. IMHO, that project was set up as a direct competitor to NPLB and RPS so we are unlikely to see any of their searchers here. In other words, could we persuade Lauren or other Free-DCers who only search for primes occassionally to join our rally? That is the big question. Since we've posted our rallies there with no success, I think it would take some Emails being sent to such individuals personally. I was able to get Beyond (Jamers) to put a quad or two on a couple of rallies by sending him an Email but I suspect he has lost access or has very limited access to many of his machines since he rarely searches anymore. One more thing: Has Free-DC prime search even ever had a rally? I haven't personally seen one. There's no way that we could offer to run one of theirs if they don't have them! :-) Last fiddled with by gd_barnes on 2010-09-02 at 20:10

2010-09-08, 15:21	#85
AMDave Jan 2006 deep in a while-loop 2·7·47 Posts	<I just cut out several paragraphs here..the remainder is much more curt, concise and constructive> This thread is well off topic. I am taking issue with the speculations' in last few posts in this thread. If you 'think but are not sure of something' then ask the person who knows the answer. Personally. @gary "I can't help but think that David was referring to" - caution on inflamatory speculation, there is a written record. No. You are blurring two lines. I can tell you you (relating to your 'gist') that the main issues were with platform stability, access stability and port & range stability - those were the main reasons that FDCPS was funded and formed. Since then they have committed will to large ranges on a small number of ports as they specified and have not wavered. Their numbers are impressive. If you have a port that matches theirs in stability and bandwidth then throw down the gauntlet! Email them. PM them. Get on the phone. Don't sit at the bar chatting about 'what-if'. Make the sparks fly! "suspect he has lost access or has very limited access to many of his machines" No. I don't believe that for a nano-second as you will find hin all over the place, if you know where to look. "since he rarely searches anymore." - now that part may be true. You should ask him about that. @karsten "PCZ only wants to hold his first place in primefinding! " so would many many many many other people. But you have got to respect the fact that they earned that place to start with, yes? Last fiddled with by AMDave on 2010-09-08 at 15:34

2010-09-08, 16:03	#87
AMDave Jan 2006 deep in a while-loop 2·7·47 Posts	re which "David" - clear as mud. henryzz would have eliminated any possibility of confusion. There are and have been several people called "David" (and hopefully many more) Referring to conversations without clear reference is always going to lead to misunderstanding. Speculative posts are always going to illicit a response. I was always going to respond and there was always a very high chance of being irrelevant. (Hence why I often regret joining these chit chats in this forum) /ed - my other comments stand I still think you guys should use your PM's vs posts more selectively. NPLB needs a marketing plan to get it to where you want it to be. I know what I think it should be. Do you know what you think it should be? As I see it, marketing chats is one of those thought processes that should not be a thread but in PM or email when in prep. That is not just an opinion - there are very valid reasons for that. Those reasons need to be taken more seriously if you want the project to pursue the directions that you desire per the forum. This project can easily get there, but for a few decisions and actions. my 2c -ed/ Last fiddled with by AMDave on 2010-09-08 at 16:15

2010-09-08, 20:02	#88
gd_barnes May 2007 Kansas; USA 3³·5·7·11 Posts	Whoa AMDave. Like Max said, I was responding to Henryzz's comments, not anything you ever said. There are way too many Dave's and David's around. Also like I said, we've posted our rallies at Free-DC many times in a row. No response. I'm not a marketer. The concept is lost on me and I don't particularly enjoy it. I don't like sales. :-) That is a big reason why I asked Max to be a co-admin of the project when it started. He has done a good job of posting our rallies here and there and keeping up with what is going on in other projects. When he plugged our last rally at PrimeGrid, he sent out the PMs that you are talking about to make sure it was OK to do so. I suppose that just a few appropriately sent Emails or PMs to the correct large searchers might help. I've sent them to Beyond, Lennart, and a couple of others at various times. I don't know if Lauren still searches but I still have his Email from when he ran the rallies with us. Perhaps I'll send him one for the next rally. I guess what I/we are looking for here are some "regulars". People who come around and stay like Vaughan has done. Why don't you enlighten us on what you think our marketing plan should be? You can send Max or me a PM if you would like. Gary Last fiddled with by gd_barnes on 2010-09-09 at 00:31

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2010-09-01, 07:04	#79
mdettweiler A Sunny Moo Aug 2007 USA (GMT-5) 3×2,083 Posts	Considering as how we're now just getting into September, we should probably get started planning the next rally. We usually try to keep them at least a month apart, so anything from the 4th week of September on is fair game. One other thing to consider: how long do we want the next one to be? IMO the 7 day rally was great fun and gave everyone sufficient time to plot takeovers and other kinds of action within the rally rankings; the shorter 48-hour rallies were over so fast that the rankings outcome was mostly predetermined at the start. I'd be in favor of doing another 7 day one, though if others would prefer shorter or longer(!), we're certainly open to suggestions. Of note, PrimeGrid's next rally is from Friday, September 24, to Thursday, October 8 (13 days long--AFAIK this is their biggest yet). We could do ours so that it finishes the day before like last time, but I wouldn't recommend doing ours directly after PrimeGrid's--theirs will be on PSP numbers this time, which are very, very large and can take more than 4 days apiece, so there will likely be an extended "cleanup period" following the rally.

2010-09-01, 08:33	#80
vaughan Jan 2005 Sydney, Australia 5×67 Posts	I liked the recent 7 day rally. It was long enough to switch over the pharm and to get some performance tweaks done (ie I managed to get at least one box running the faster application :) ) I agree we should plan it so as not to clash with a major BOINC project or we will struggle for participants.

2010-09-01, 12:48	#81
henryzz Just call me Henry "David" Sep 2007 Cambridge (GMT/BST) 2³·3·5·7² Posts	Is there any way we can pursuade free-dc to join us for a week rally? Like offering to run one of their rallies. That amount of competition would be awesome.

2010-09-01, 23:11	#83
kar_bon Mar 2006 Germany 2³·3·11² Posts	Seems quite right! PCZ is crunching alone (4 other 'users' got almost the same amout in pairs/points; perhaps a quad left alone). 'Free-DC' is only PCZ for a longer time now, he's reporting almost every day new primes of that 3rd drive (k=6000-7000) from about n=480 at the beginning to 670k, then just jumping to 700k-710k, back to 670k and now at n=690. So I think no response for our next rally. PCZ only wants to hold his first place in primefinding!