Slaughter in Gaza

[tha]

If you want to know how to maximize the number of civilian casualties the IDF has been so kind to put the manual on its blog.

[chalsall]

Originally Posted by tha

If you want to know how to maximize the number of civilian casualties the IDF has been so kind to put the manual on its blog.

OK. Interesting.

One might have thought that a manual might have been brought forward what minimizes civilian casualties.

But, perhaps, the modern times are somewhat similar to the old times...

"Kill them all. And let the gods sort it out."

[Prime95]

Originally Posted by tha

So who is responsible for the civilian casualties in Gaza?

a. First and foremost Europe and the US who shell out the rewards.
b. Second, Hamas for ensuring the casualties are there.
c. A long list of everyone, no one in particular and so on.
d. Israel for dropping the actual bombs.

This has to rank as the stupidest analysis I've seen in a long time. Not at all surprising it comes in a thread about the Israeli-Palestinian conflict.

Using this fine logic, consider a neighborhood gang kid throwing rocks at a house, three adults are cheering him on, house owner tires of this takes out a bazooka and blow the kid away, the cops are called. You think the priority for the cops should be:

a. Arrest the three adults doing the cheering.
b. Arrest other gang members for encouraging the kid to throw rocks.
c. Arrest the parents of the kid for not teaching him better, arrest the kids grandparents for spreading around bad DNA, arrest local newspaper editor for writing an editorial on the joys of rock throwing, blah, blah, blah.
d. Let the guy with the bazooka go.

[Prime95]

Originally Posted by fivemack

...Israel ... knows that it will be shooting at non-combatants; and Israel is therefore deliberately killing schoolchildren. It has a very easy alternative: hold fire.

Originally Posted by R.D. Silverman

Hamas uses its population as human shields. The responsibility for these deaths lies with them.

The whole exercise of laying blame is an absolutely pointless waste of time. Stop it. Each side has *plenty* of incidents they can point to to justify poor behavior.

The more important question for Israel is what is the best policy going forward that might lead to a peaceful co-existence two or three generations from now?

Hamas should be asking itself the same question, but peace is not even their stated goal. Therefore, Israel needs to embark on a long-term plan that strengthens the Palestinian population's desire to at least tolerate Israel's existence. I think the current campaign does not do this. It bolsters yet another generation's hatred of Israel while not solving the rocket/tunnel issue. Rockets will be bought and tunnels rebuilt within a few years.

What should Israel's response be to ineffective rocket launches and tunnels that lead to occasional deadly attacks inside Israel? I don't have the answer. I'd like to hear bright ideas for our learned forum readers.

I'll kick it off with two flawed options.

1) The dove approach: Recognize that the attacks are not a threat to Israel's existence -- turn the other cheek. This is little comfort to the families of the dozen or so Israeli casualties one can expect each year from such a policy.

2) The hawk approach: Give Hamas an ultimatum. If the rockets and border crossings do not stop, Israel will begin construction of mile-or-so wide buffer. All Palestinians currently in the buffer area will be evicted -- tough shit.

[chalsall]

Originally Posted by Prime95

What should Israel's response be to ineffective rocket launches and tunnels that lead to occasional deadly attacks inside Israel? I don't have the answer. I'd like to hear bright ideas for our learned forum readers.

Please correct me if I am wrong, but was not Israel created after the second world war? A land taken, and then protected?

[Prime95]

Originally Posted by chalsall

Please correct me if I am wrong, but was not Israel created after the second world war? A land taken, and then protected?

The point?

IMO, in order to move forward both sides must deal with the facts as they are today.

[chalsall]

Originally Posted by Prime95

The point?

IMO, in order to move forward both sides must deal with the facts as they are today.

The point is perhaps those who have had things taken away from them might be a little pissed off.

Imagine.

[Prime95]

Originally Posted by chalsall

Imagine.

Not hard to imagine at all. However, the deed can't be undone. A complete non-starter.

Get out of the blame game and into the solution game.

[chalsall]

Originally Posted by Prime95

Get out of the blame game and into the solution game.

What, then, is the solution?

[Prime95]

Originally Posted by chalsall

What, then, is the solution?

I already stated I don't have one. One may not exist. If one does exist, I believe it will take generations to successfully implement.

My main point was that both sides are still caught up in a pointless "who's more at fault" game rather than working toward a real long-term solution.

[chalsall]

Originally Posted by Prime95

I already stated I don't have one. One may not exist. If one does exist, I believe it will take generations to successfully implement.

My main point was that both sides are still caught up in a pointless "who's more at fault" game rather than working toward a real long-term solution.

Sorry. I don't actually have any "skin in this game", beyond the deaths which endanger everyone.