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2020-10-16, 15:53   #1288
masser

Jul 2003

33×5×11 Posts

Quote:
 Originally Posted by Dr Sardonicus On the one hand, we can look forward to the prospect of an "extinction dinner" in which the participants consume the remains of the last member of a species to have lived in the wild, or perhaps to have lived at all.
Reminds me of this movie...

2020-10-16, 15:53   #1289
The Carnivore

Jun 2010

3×71 Posts

Quote:
 Originally Posted by Dr Sardonicus On the one hand, we can look forward to the prospect of an "extinction dinner" in which the participants consume the remains of the last member of a species to have lived in the wild, or perhaps to have lived at all.
I'd also argue that humans developing a taste for a certain species is more likely to increase the population of that species than to decrease it or to drive it down to zero. Excluding insects, some of the most numerous animals on the planet are those that we consider to be tasty:

https://www.ecowatch.com/amp/biomass...als-2571413930

It may be counterintuitive, but the best way to increase biodiversity would be to eat a greater variety of species, instead of just a few.

Quote:
 Originally Posted by retina Food is just fuel. It gets broken down, the useful parts are extracted, and the rest is ed out.
In a practical sense, yes. But the taste and bonding experience of sharing an exotic meal can be just as satisfying as the nutrition obtained from that meal, in the same way that the journey can be just as fulfilling as the destination of a trip.

 2020-10-16, 19:20 #1290 Dr Sardonicus     Feb 2017 Nowhere 74728 Posts Big ag animals, huh? Let's see. Cows. Pigs. Sheep. Chickens. A lot of biomass to be sure, but four is not a lot of species. You might enjoy reading A Statue for Father by Isaac Asimov. Humans have been wiping out species for food since the stone age. It isn't hard to find lists of them online. Here in the USA, one species that comes to mind is the passenger pigeon. John James Audubon reckoned it was the most numerous bird on the continent. But it was cheap food. The last specimen died in captivity in 1914. Modern "big ag" agricultural practices are also not necessarily good for species other than those we eat. There are however a number of animals which, though generally considered to be pests, have greatly benefitted from humans. These include the black rat, the Norway rat, the house mouse, the rabbit (in Australia), and the European Starling (in North America). Other animals have become pests due to human efforts to exterminate their predators. White-tailed deer and mule deer come to mind. Efforts to control their numbers, in the absence of their natural predators, often include hunting. One bird species whose range has been greatly extended by human activity is the Turkey Vulture. One story exhibiting a lack of respect for the Mighty Hunter is Poor Little Warrior! by Brian Aldiss.
2020-10-16, 22:29   #1291
The Carnivore

Jun 2010

3×71 Posts

Quote:
 Originally Posted by Dr Sardonicus Big ag animals, huh? Let's see. Cows. Pigs. Sheep. Chickens. A lot of biomass to be sure, but four is not a lot of species. You might enjoy reading A Statue for Father by Isaac Asimov. Humans have been wiping out species for food since the stone age. It isn't hard to find lists of them online. Here in the USA, one species that comes to mind is the passenger pigeon. John James Audubon reckoned it was the most numerous bird on the continent. But it was cheap food. The last specimen died in captivity in 1914. Modern "big ag" agricultural practices are also not necessarily good for species other than those we eat.
Native Americans have hunted and eaten passenger pigeon meat for thousands of years without adversely impacting the passenger pigeon population. So eating a species and protecting that species aren't mutually exclusive. Of course, hunting can and should be done sustainably, which wasn't the case for the passenger pigeon.

Diversifying our diets to include exotic meats would reduce the large-scale farms dedicated to only 1-2 kinds of meat. Our chicken consumption is already likely to leave a noticeable fossil record:
https://www.newscientist.com/article...s-will-remain/

Substituting exotic meats for some of our conventional meats benefits both the environment and our health, as wild animal meat often has fewer calories, cholesterol, and saturated fat than factory-farmed animal meat. And there are plenty of options out there. For example, kangaroo is a sustainable alternative to beef: https://www.nationalgeographic.com/c...ernative-meat/

and so is yak: http://www.takepart.com/article/2014/07/15/yak-meat

And you know what meat has the least animal suffering and environmental impact? Roadkill!

Bon appetit!

 2020-10-17, 06:55 #1292 MooMoo2     Aug 2010 11248 Posts More wacky, WTF stuff: https://www.exoticmeatmarkets.com/Li...onmeat16oz.htm $50K for a pound of lion meat 2020-10-18, 18:24 #1293 kriesel "TF79LL86GIMPS96gpu17" Mar 2017 US midwest 2×2,383 Posts Quote:  Originally Posted by Dr Sardonicus Big ag animals, huh? Let's see. Cows. Pigs. Sheep. Chickens. A lot of biomass to be sure, but four is not a lot of species. Goats, horses, camels, ducks, turkeys, geese are also economically significant domesticated species, although animals ridden have a sort of food taboo attached. (But recipes are easily found online.) Plus the less common, ostrich, emu, bison, etc. And aquaculture. Quote:  Originally Posted by MooMoo2$50K for a pound of lion meat
Could buy a lot of fast gpus for that cost.

Last fiddled with by kriesel on 2020-10-18 at 18:25

2020-10-18, 22:20   #1294
PhilF

Feb 2005

2×32×31 Posts

Quote:
 Originally Posted by kriesel Could buy a lot of fast gpus for that cost.
But they wouldn't taste as good.

2020-10-19, 06:13   #1295
LaurV
Romulan Interpreter

Jun 2011
Thailand

8,963 Posts

Quote:
 Originally Posted by kriesel Could buy a lot of pork meat for that cost.
Quote:
 Originally Posted by PhilF And they would taste a lot better.

Fixed it for you two... Additionally, pork meat will be more healthy than lion meat.

2020-10-19, 07:05   #1296
retina
Undefined

"The unspeakable one"
Jun 2006
My evil lair

2×7×421 Posts

Quote:
 Originally Posted by LaurV Additionally, pork meat will be more healthy than lion meat.
More healthy for whom? It sure isn't healthier for the pig.

And what is wrong with lion meat? Or is it something else, like an angry mod attacking you, that causes the unhealthiness?

 2020-10-19, 10:42 #1297 LaurV Romulan Interpreter     Jun 2011 Thailand 214038 Posts Being a carnivore myself (albeit I never ate lion in my life) I can say that, contrary to what "experts" say, pork meat is the best for your body, compared with almost all other types of meats. Technically, human meat is the best, but I am a bit afraid to eat my neighbors or my friends (afraid like, what my wife would say? ) Pigs are omnivores, they eat everything humans eat, and they have a metabolism very close to humans, therefore accumulating in their body and tissues all the "good stuff" your body needs, contrary to herbivores (big ruminants) or carnivores (big and small cats, dogs), who are always missing something (like amino-acids, or stuff) or are poisonous for you (i.e. dog liver). Eating only plants won't supply you with many things your body needs. You can't survive only on plants diet for all your life, you still need meat or supplements from time to time. Want to be vegetarian? Be my guest, but don't pollute my life with it. From this point of view, vegetarians going public with it and making such a big fuss about how much they care about the planet, are, in my eyes, the same hypocrites like jehova's witnesses who ring your door to convince you to go to their religion. You know something? Fcuk off! I am not a racist, nor a misogynist (well, this I may be a little, bit don't tell to the ladies on this forum!), neither have any prejudices, and I have never seen a woman or a black person, or a gay person, ringing my door to try to convince me to become a woman, or a black person, or a gay. That's why I have no prejudice toward them, and I respect them and their ways without discrimination, but vegetarians? Hm... if you want to be vegetarian, or vegan, then be that in YOUR house. Back to pork meat, well, your body will always make a lower effort to break down and assimilate things which are similar to its need and its structure, compared with things which are different and need a lot of re-combinations to be usable (like plants, or even beef - and that's why you get fat eating pork, not because the pork is fat - actually I was a fat eater all my life, this includes pork, but also other "poisons" (like margarine) and I didn't get my actual big belly until I got older and lazy and stopped exercising almost completely). So, yeah, I am a fat pig, but not because I eat pork. Because I am f'king lazy... I am still eating pork with the same pleasure like 50 years ago. Along my life, I ate all the farming meat (pork, beef, sheep, rabbit, etc), as well as dog (once), most probably cat too (unknown, but as a component of many Italian salamis, you never know!), snake (many times, one restaurant in the neighborhood when I was working in China used to make a wonderful snake soup!), frogs, crocodile (few times, bought from superstore here in Thailand), kangaroos (few times, during my two Australian trips), as well as almost all kind of big game (I mean "usual" game, not tigers and lions, but things you can catch or shot in Romania, like deer, boar, bear - my grandma used to make a very good bear pastrami when I was a child), many kinds of birds (including pigeons), fish, or marine animals (kind of basic diet for the last years, Thai people eat a lot of sea food). Edit: Yep, and some Thai delicacies like crickets, bamboo worms, cockroaches, etc. What I didn't eat in Thailand (have to try once!) is lizard meat (quite common, but didn't have the opportunity). I also missed few things I heard other people eat, like rats or squirrels (have to try once, too!). Last fiddled with by LaurV on 2020-10-19 at 11:29
2020-10-19, 14:16   #1298
Dr Sardonicus

Feb 2017
Nowhere

2·1,949 Posts

Quote:
 Originally Posted by The Carnivore And you know what meat has the least animal suffering and environmental impact? Roadkill!
I wouldn't be so sure of that. According to, e.g. the 2004 article about how roads affect the ecology, The Ecology of Roadkill (my emphasis),

Quote:
 No ecological effect, however, is more direct, self-evident, or quantifiable than "road mortality." In the United States, people kill more wildlife with their cars than they do any other way. Vehicles are the chief cause of death for moose in the Kenai National Wildlife Refuge in Alaska. Roads near Lake Jackson, Florida, are dangerous for turtles: More than 2,000 die per mile there each year. And 150 auto passengers are killed each year in animal collisions. "Clearly," Forman says, "if I run into a moose, I'm in trouble." Road deaths affect whole species, particularly when large carnivores (which reproduce slowly) and small amphibians (which die en masse) are involved. In the 1980s and 1990s, 42 percent of all deaths of Florida panthers were caused by cars, and a recent study concluded that road mortality is so high that it may threaten the persistence of some turtle populations in the northeastern United States.
As to eating roadkill, it is an obvious factor in the increased range of Turkey Vultures in the US.

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