mersenneforum.org  

Go Back   mersenneforum.org > Great Internet Mersenne Prime Search > PrimeNet

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 2021-04-11, 12:34   #12
firejuggler
 
firejuggler's Avatar
 
"Vincent"
Apr 2010
Over the rainbow

284510 Posts
Default

But... what about exponent that prp say they are probable prime? The communitty will probably snatch it fast but still... What will we do? a PRP-DC? or a LL (first time LL?) and a PRP-DC?
firejuggler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2021-04-11, 14:39   #13
kriesel
 
kriesel's Avatar
 
"TF79LL86GIMPS96gpu17"
Mar 2017
US midwest

32×733 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by firejuggler View Post
But... what about exponent that prp say they are probable prime? The communitty will probably snatch it fast but still... What will we do? a PRP-DC? or a LL (first time LL?) and a PRP-DC?
What I expect is this:
It takes years to occur. Someone's prime95 that's PrimeNet connected gets and completes the PRP test on the lucky exponent. That someone is considered the discoverer.
Someone gets the Cert assignment for it and completes it via prime95 and PrimeNet API.
The server spots the completed PRP confirmed and attempts to alert Woltman and a select few others of a probable new prime by email.
If that fails, Madpoo sees it during server maintenance and alerts George and Ernst.
A select few trusted participants run LL tests on the fastest most reliable hardware they can use, on Mlucas, mprime or prime95, CUDALucas, and on a Gpuowl V6.11-3xx version selected for speed for the relevant fft length and Jacobi check availability.
Assuming it's not a false alarm / bug, there's a preliminary announcement of a new find without specifics, followed by an official press release, timed for high coverage, soon enough to avoid leaks, and not on the first day of April.
And there's no EFF prize awarded, because M52 is not 100Mdigit or larger.
Then it takes several more years before M53 is apparently found, which has a shot at the 100Mdigit EFF prize.
https://www.mersenneforum.org/showpo...5&postcount=14

Last fiddled with by kriesel on 2021-04-11 at 15:03
kriesel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2021-04-11, 18:33   #14
ATH
Einyen
 
ATH's Avatar
 
Dec 2003
Denmark

2·1,669 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by firejuggler View Post
But... what about exponent that prp say they are probable prime? The communitty will probably snatch it fast but still... What will we do? a PRP-DC? or a LL (first time LL?) and a PRP-DC?
These will only be the future Mersenne Primes, and we will run 2+ LL tests on different hardware and using different software Prime95/Mlucas/Gpuowl/CUDALucas like all the previous Mersenne Primes.

We will not find a PRP that is not prime.
ATH is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2021-04-30, 17:25   #15
kriesel
 
kriesel's Avatar
 
"TF79LL86GIMPS96gpu17"
Mar 2017
US midwest

659710 Posts
Default

It looks like the server assignments change has been effective.
Just now I asked it for https://www.mersenne.org/assignments...chk=1&excert=1
and of the 1000 returned, sorting by type, just eleven are LL (1.1%).
These pending LL tasks assignments were issued not later than 2021-04-08.
(Assignments would not indicate any end-user manual changes from PRP to LL though. Hopefully those are very rare.)

Quote:
Originally Posted by M344587487 View Post
This is a big deal, there should be cake.
Indeed!

Quote:
Originally Posted by ATH View Post
Lucas-Lehmer tests have served us well for over 24 years. They can rest now, but will be hopefully be called upon again soon for the honor of verifying the next Mersenne Prime.
2021 April - 1996 January = 25+. So yes, definitely over 24.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ATH View Post
we will run 2+ LL tests on different hardware and using different software Prime95/Mlucas/Gpuowl/CUDALucas like all the previous Mersenne Primes.
With paired runs or sharing of interim res64 values likely on larger exponents. The bigger the exponent, the more likely a lone LL test goes wrong before completion without such checks along the way. https://www.mersenneforum.org/showpo...6&postcount=14

Last fiddled with by kriesel on 2021-04-30 at 17:45
kriesel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2021-04-30, 19:08   #16
kriesel
 
kriesel's Avatar
 
"TF79LL86GIMPS96gpu17"
Mar 2017
US midwest

32×733 Posts
Default Hypothetical questions on prime confirmation in the age of PRP first test

When a new Mersenne prime is found by GIMPS, by an LL test, the first confirmation check is usually George acquires the last interim save file from the lucky discoverer and reruns it from that point to completion, to reproduce the prime result, or not.

Let us suppose that someone running Gpuowl v6.11-x gets a lucky exponent assigned and finds M52.
And they were running PRP with proof generation, and the -cleanup option.
Code:
-cleanup           : delete save files at end of run
Or they found it with Gpuowl v7.x-y PRP with proof generation. And were not using the -noclean option.
Code:
-noclean           : do not delete data after the test is complete.
The last save file is gone. It cannot be provided to George for the usual confirmatory run of the last iterations.
All that remain are the result file and the gpuowl log file.
1) Since there's been a PRP proof file generated and uploaded, does it matter there are no save files on the discoverer's system?

Now suppose it was v7.1-x, and the proof file generated was bad.
2) How does that change things?

Now suppose the exponent is over 100Mdigit. It takes 2 weeks to run a primality test on a fast gpu, longer on a multicore Xeon. LL test reliability with Jacobi check is ~1-2% error for wavefront exponents, much higher (~10%; 20% without Jacobi) for 100Mdigit.
(Challenges of large exponents https://www.mersenneforum.org/showpo...6&postcount=14)
3) How will that affect how the prime discovery confirmation is performed?

4) What techniques may be used or added to make the next Mersenne prime discovery confirmation faster or more reliable?
(Interim res64 values as additional error check input https://www.mersenneforum.org/showpo...&postcount=20; what else?)
kriesel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2021-04-30, 20:18   #17
slandrum
 
Jan 2021
California

22·107 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by kriesel View Post
It looks like the server assignments change has been effective
I've also noticed that the trailing edge DC assignments are filling in much faster than before, probably due to several factors, but a not insignificant one is that LL FTC requests are now returning LL DC assignments.
slandrum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2021-04-30, 21:58   #18
kriesel
 
kriesel's Avatar
 
"TF79LL86GIMPS96gpu17"
Mar 2017
US midwest

32·733 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by slandrum View Post
I've also noticed that the trailing edge DC assignments are filling in much faster than before, probably due to several factors, but a not insignificant one is that LL FTC requests are now returning LL DC assignments.
That effect seems modest to me; ~15-25% to Mp#48*, declining below M56M.
Attached Files
File Type: pdf mp48verificationmilestoneestimate.pdf (24.2 KB, 118 views)
kriesel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2021-05-01, 01:28   #19
slandrum
 
Jan 2021
California

22×107 Posts
Default

That's a little different than what I'm talking about. The number of DC assignments at the bottom that are fully assigned before you find an available DC assignment has been growing over the last 3 weeks. The number of exponents being assigned on average/day in cat0/cat1 has increased in the last 3 weeks.

It takes a little bit of time to see that in the cleared results, but we should start seeing that soon, the new rule only went into affect 3 weeks ago.

Last fiddled with by slandrum on 2021-05-01 at 01:29
slandrum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2021-06-14, 14:32   #20
P-A
 
P-A's Avatar
 
Aug 2005
Copenhagen, DK

24 Posts
Default

As LL will be finished at some point, would it be possible to have a countdown on the milestones page to count down to last LL test being finished?
P-A is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2021-06-14, 16:39   #21
slandrum
 
Jan 2021
California

1AC16 Posts
Default

There are still people choosing to do FTC LL, overriding their assignments to do it.
slandrum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2021-06-14, 18:03   #22
Uncwilly
6809 > 6502
 
Uncwilly's Avatar
 
"""""""""""""""""""
Aug 2003
101×103 Posts

13·19·43 Posts
Default

And there are people doing PRP-DC's, overriding their assignments to do it,
Uncwilly is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Time to End davar55 Lounge 4 2013-02-23 02:40
P95 est time to go seems off bcp19 Software 1 2012-08-03 22:39
New .dat time? benjackson Prime Sierpinski Project 16 2008-07-29 07:26
Time Xyzzy Science & Technology 26 2008-01-19 03:28
We'll be done in no time!!!! petrw1 Hardware 6 2006-11-30 08:49

All times are UTC. The time now is 01:31.


Wed Jul 6 01:31:42 UTC 2022 up 82 days, 23:33, 0 users, load averages: 1.25, 1.29, 1.39

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2022, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

This forum has received and complied with 0 (zero) government requests for information.

Permission is granted to copy, distribute and/or modify this document under the terms of the GNU Free Documentation License, Version 1.2 or any later version published by the Free Software Foundation.
A copy of the license is included in the FAQ.

≠ ± ∓ ÷ × · − √ ‰ ⊗ ⊕ ⊖ ⊘ ⊙ ≤ ≥ ≦ ≧ ≨ ≩ ≺ ≻ ≼ ≽ ⊏ ⊐ ⊑ ⊒ ² ³ °
∠ ∟ ° ≅ ~ ‖ ⟂ ⫛
≡ ≜ ≈ ∝ ∞ ≪ ≫ ⌊⌋ ⌈⌉ ∘ ∏ ∐ ∑ ∧ ∨ ∩ ∪ ⨀ ⊕ ⊗ 𝖕 𝖖 𝖗 ⊲ ⊳
∅ ∖ ∁ ↦ ↣ ∩ ∪ ⊆ ⊂ ⊄ ⊊ ⊇ ⊃ ⊅ ⊋ ⊖ ∈ ∉ ∋ ∌ ℕ ℤ ℚ ℝ ℂ ℵ ℶ ℷ ℸ 𝓟
¬ ∨ ∧ ⊕ → ← ⇒ ⇐ ⇔ ∀ ∃ ∄ ∴ ∵ ⊤ ⊥ ⊢ ⊨ ⫤ ⊣ … ⋯ ⋮ ⋰ ⋱
∫ ∬ ∭ ∮ ∯ ∰ ∇ ∆ δ ∂ ℱ ℒ ℓ
𝛢𝛼 𝛣𝛽 𝛤𝛾 𝛥𝛿 𝛦𝜀𝜖 𝛧𝜁 𝛨𝜂 𝛩𝜃𝜗 𝛪𝜄 𝛫𝜅 𝛬𝜆 𝛭𝜇 𝛮𝜈 𝛯𝜉 𝛰𝜊 𝛱𝜋 𝛲𝜌 𝛴𝜎𝜍 𝛵𝜏 𝛶𝜐 𝛷𝜙𝜑 𝛸𝜒 𝛹𝜓 𝛺𝜔