mersenneforum.org  

Go Back   mersenneforum.org > Extra Stuff > Soap Box

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 2012-03-04, 18:31   #56
R.D. Silverman
 
R.D. Silverman's Avatar
 
Nov 2003

161008 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by garo View Post
Then how do you explain recent research that has shown that the more educated Republicans were the less fact-based their opinions were? Things like anthropogenic climate change or even Obama being a Muslim.

But then again, more education does not mean more intelligent.... And highly educated people are probably more likely to fall into the trap of thinking they know everything and that strengthens their confirmation bias.
Certainly possible.
R.D. Silverman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2012-03-04, 22:43   #57
Christenson
 
Christenson's Avatar
 
Dec 2010
Monticello

24×107 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by garo View Post
Then how do you explain recent research that has shown that the more educated Republicans were the less fact-based their opinions were? Things like anthropogenic climate change or even Obama being a Muslim.

But then again, more education does not mean more intelligent.... And highly educated people are probably more likely to fall into the trap of thinking they know everything and that strengthens their confirmation bias.
How about they recognize and use the reward system based on their ignorance?
Christenson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2012-03-05, 05:31   #58
cheesehead
 
cheesehead's Avatar
 
"Richard B. Woods"
Aug 2002
Wisconsin USA

1C1416 Posts
Default

How about let's all recognize that at least some of the conservative vs. liberal differences sprout from fundamentally different ways of viewing the world, not from differences in intelligence, and not from other ways of denigrating the other side's humanness? *

IMO we need more experts to impartially translate and explain each side's views so that the other side can readily understand, and vice versa. *

- - -

* These are not to claim that I succeed in doing either, but to express that I wish I could do better in my attempts, and wish I'd realized their importance earlier in life.

Last fiddled with by cheesehead on 2012-03-05 at 05:34
cheesehead is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2012-03-06, 00:21   #59
Christenson
 
Christenson's Avatar
 
Dec 2010
Monticello

24·107 Posts
Default

I get beaten up for trying to point out differences in thought patterns (and that is what they are, whether we regard life as a zero sum game or morally-protectible life beginning at a certain ineffable point, or whether we see fortune(chance) playing a role in our lives or not )

The crazy part about it is that I am seeing the same issues of parasitism in corporations as Tea-party folks (and myself) see in government (or especially, universities). There seems to be those who want to produce, and those that want to parasitise, and they are all nice enough folks to talk to.
Christenson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2012-03-10, 20:04   #60
ewmayer
2ω=0
 
ewmayer's Avatar
 
Sep 2002
República de California

231028 Posts
Default

After watching a snip on a recent evening newscast showing über-phony Mitt "tungsten coiffure" Romney trying to act all folksy and man-of-the-peoplish at a recent town-hall-style event, I got the oddest idea that he probably uses some kind of boutique service which rents carefully-selected preworn denim bluejeans to rich 50something white dudes who are trying to act folksy. The jeans of course clashed fiercely with his starched-collar Wall Streeter shirt and immovable hair-do, but at least one of his people was apparently reminded him to remove the tassels from his hand-crafted designer shoes before going onstage.

Last fiddled with by ewmayer on 2012-03-10 at 20:05
ewmayer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2012-03-13, 04:33   #61
Christenson
 
Christenson's Avatar
 
Dec 2010
Monticello

24·107 Posts
Default

Reminds me of politician George Allen, riding a horse in a parade...with an aide holding one stirrup onto the saddle it had come loose from. I'm a *distinctly* casual rider, and riding without stirrups is a required lesson exercise......when you get good, at the trot or canter....
Christenson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2012-03-21, 19:39   #62
ewmayer
2ω=0
 
ewmayer's Avatar
 
Sep 2002
República de California

2·59·83 Posts
Default Romney Proposes $8 Trillion Welfare Program for Defense Contractors

At the risk of sounding like Cheesehead, anyone needing more evidence that "fiscally prudent" (their claim, not ours) Republicans are either utter math-ignoramuses (possible, but unlikely) or lying liars (our bet is on that one) can find it here:

Mitt Romney Proposes $8 Trillion Welfare Program for Defense Contractors
Quote:
If you’ve been fretting about faltering math education and falling test scores here in the United States, you should be worried based on this campaign season of Republican math. When it comes to the American military, the leading Republican presidential candidates evidently only learned to add and multiply, never subtract or divide.

Despite current Pentagon budgets that have hovered at the highest levels since World War II and 13 years of steady growth, the administration’s latest plans would only reduce spending at the Department of Defense by 1.6% in inflation-adjusted dollars over the next five years.

Still, compared to his main Republican opponents, Obama is a T. rex of budget slashers.

After all, despite their stated commitment to reducing the deficit (while cutting taxes on the rich yet more), the Republican contenders are intent on raising Pentagon spending dramatically. Mitt Romney has staked out the “high ground” in the latest round of Republican math with a proposal to set Pentagon spending at 4% of the Gross Domestic Product (GDP). That would, in fact add up to an astonishing $8.3 trillion dollars over the next decade, one-third more than current, already bloated Pentagon plans.

Nathan Hodge of the Wall Street Journal engaged in polite understatement when he described the Romney plan as “the most optimistic forecast U.S. defense manufacturers have heard in months.”

In fact, Romney’s proposal implies that the Pentagon is essentially an entitlement program that should receive a set share of our total economic resources regardless of what’s happening here at home or elsewhere on the planet. In Romney World, the Pentagon’s only role would be to engorge itself. If the GDP were to drop, it’s unlikely that, as president, he would reduce Pentagon spending accordingly.

Rick Santorum has spent far less time describing his military spending plans, but a remark at a Republican presidential debate in Arizona suggests that he is at least on the same page with Romney.
ewmayer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2012-03-21, 20:56   #63
Zeta-Flux
 
Zeta-Flux's Avatar
 
May 2003

2·761 Posts
Default

Quote:
At the risk of sounding like Cheesehead, anyone needing more evidence that "fiscally prudent" (their claim, not ours) Republicans are either utter math-ignoramuses (possible, but unlikely) or lying liars (our bet is on that one) can find it here
Hey! Herman Cain was a math major!

Humor aside, I don't find your rhetoric nor your false dichotomies particularly enlightening. We all know that people in both parties seem to ignore their basic principles (and I'm not sure I'd do any better). But, frankly, I'll take Mitt Romney's abilities with regards to economy over Obama's any day.

I dislike as much as anyone the fact that under George Bush our deficit spending skyrocketed, and fiscal conservatism was ignored. But the question has to be asked: did Obama do better or worse? And the follow up question: will Romney do better or worse than Obama would if he continues?

We can all find flaws with every single candidate on some economic issue or another. I suppose it helps us to recognize the hypocrisy, but it can be damaging if we focus so much on the faults of one that we ignore the even bigger faults of another.
Zeta-Flux is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2012-03-22, 03:36   #64
Xyzzy
 
Xyzzy's Avatar
 
"Mike"
Aug 2002

22×41×47 Posts
Default

http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/sideshow...152901719.html
Xyzzy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2012-03-25, 20:36   #65
ewmayer
2ω=0
 
ewmayer's Avatar
 
Sep 2002
República de California

2·59·83 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zeta-Flux View Post
Humor aside, I don't find your rhetoric nor your false dichotomies particularly enlightening. We all know that people in both parties seem to ignore their basic principles (and I'm not sure I'd do any better). But, frankly, I'll take Mitt Romney's abilities with regards to economy over Obama's any day.

I dislike as much as anyone the fact that under George Bush our deficit spending skyrocketed, and fiscal conservatism was ignored. But the question has to be asked: did Obama do better or worse? And the follow up question: will Romney do better or worse than Obama would if he continues?

We can all find flaws with every single candidate on some economic issue or another. I suppose it helps us to recognize the hypocrisy, but it can be damaging if we focus so much on the faults of one that we ignore the even bigger faults of another.
To me, Obama is merely the best of a bunch of verry-bad options ... as I've stated on numerous occasions in the MET threads, my main beef with Obama is his huge lies about "getting tough with the fat cats on Wall Street", who of course funded his campaign and own him to a similar extent as they do the likes of Mitt Romney (himself one the very same fat cats) and O's last opponent, John McCain. That fact of being bank-owned makes Obama as vulnerable as does the risk of the fake economic recovery he is touting falling apart spectacularly before the election. Not that any of the GOP frontrunners - including Mr. Phony jobs-creator Romney, whose claims to creating any U.S. jobs start and end with the professional corporate asset-strip-miners at his former firm on Wall Street - are any less-beholden to Big Finance or any more clueful on the causes and cures out of our current generational economic malaise, but the buck indeed stops with the man currently in charge, meaning those aspiring to his position basically have carte blanche to indulge their mega-hypocrisy.

Anyway, of all his beholden-to-Wall-Street aspects, his close ties to MF Global's Jon Corzine may be Obama's biggest liability - the administration is surely jumping through hopps to try to mkae this one go away, but alas the evidence of flat-out crimilaity-from-the-top keeps mounting:

Corzine is Going to be the Best Show Since Watergate
Quote:
Courtesy of Russ Winter of Winter Watch at Wall Street Examiner

Finally after five months of investigations comes the Jon Corzine MF Global bombshell Friday [Bloomberg: Corzine Ordered Funds Moved to JP Morgan]. The Bloomberg article references an e-mail written by Edith O’Brien, the assistant Treasurer at MF Global and a memo written by congressional staffers. A few aspects are of note: first that Corzine “gave direct instructions” to transfer $200 million in segregated consumer funds to JP Morgan for payment on an overdraft and used a lower level functionary O’Brien to carry it out. Then in a clear violation of fiduciary responsibility JP Morgan’s risk officer asked MF Global for a letter stating these funds were not customer segregated accounts, but then took the money anyway. The chief counsel for MF Global nixed the letter JPM sent over as “too strong”.

O”Brien is to testify before Congress on Wednesday, but will plead the Fifth. This suggests she has not been offered a deal, or immunity.

The captured regulatory agencies have not weighed in on this now nearly five months after this historic crime. On the overall issue of fraud and regulatory capture, view this Max Keiser and Mark Melin clip.

The Corzine ties into the labyrinth of the Obama Administration are dark and deep. It is a virtual 6 degrees of Kevin Bacon sistema (the word used for this form of government in Brazil) and in every sense of the word a criminal enterprise. Here are various clips of Obama and Biden heaping praise on Jon Corzine.

This is what Obama says about Jon Corzine. I can see why Obama likes him so much. They both have the same moral compass.

“Like many of us in public life today, Jon is a leader who’s been called to govern in some extraordinary times. He’s been tested by the worst recession in half a century — a recession that was caused by years of recklessness and irresponsibility and a do-nothing attitude. It was caused by the same small thinking that has plagued our politics for decades — the kind of thinking that says we can afford to just tinker around with our problems, we can put off the tough decisions, defer the big challenges. We can just tell people what they want to hear instead of what they need to hear. Well that’s not the kind of leader that Jon Corzine is.”– Barack Obama, July 2009
.
-and “John Corzine is the smartest man in the room”….Joe Biden

It is hard for me to imagine that Obama can shuck and jive this one. Is he really going to revert to his shameful 60 minutes interview where he makes excuses for criminal conduct on Wall Street and twists the logic around to make himself look righteous. I have to think he may just turn the dogs loose on Corzine, but where does that lead? Corzine was more than a fund bundler, crony, and influence peddler. He was instrumental in stacking the Obama administration with his associates. What happens with CFTC apparatchik and former Corzine employee at Goldman Sachs, Gary Gensler for example? CFTC was charged with regulating MF Global. What about Eric “Empty Suit” Holder, Obama’s attorney general, who never met a Wall Street crime he didn’t like? And what about JP Morgan’s role in this? This should and might be the biggest story since Watergate. My favorite from the wag comment gallery: “Can we possibly take down Corzine, JP Morgan, and Obama all in one fell swoop? No way my life gets that good!!! No way.”
ewmayer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2012-03-26, 01:18   #66
Zeta-Flux
 
Zeta-Flux's Avatar
 
May 2003

2·761 Posts
Default

ewmayer,

While I don't concur with your opinion, after reading through all the hyperbole I think your basic message was "My man Obama is ragged on, and I don't want the others to have a free pass." I can understand that. Carry on.
Zeta-Flux is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Avgvst 2016 Batalov Puzzles 21 2016-09-04 11:40
June 2016 Xyzzy Puzzles 16 2016-07-07 02:51
EM 2016 Cybertronic Soap Box 1 2016-06-26 21:03
May 2016 Xyzzy Puzzles 6 2016-06-06 19:02
April 2016 Xyzzy Puzzles 10 2016-05-05 05:42

All times are UTC. The time now is 05:21.

Thu Oct 29 05:21:41 UTC 2020 up 49 days, 2:32, 1 user, load averages: 1.42, 1.44, 1.44

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

This forum has received and complied with 0 (zero) government requests for information.

Permission is granted to copy, distribute and/or modify this document under the terms of the GNU Free Documentation License, Version 1.2 or any later version published by the Free Software Foundation.
A copy of the license is included in the FAQ.