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 2022-07-25, 11:43 #89 swellman     Jun 2012 384810 Posts QUEUED AS 314__757_19m1 So, for the record, we are enqueuing this with 15e: Code: n: 15408601493056043415906090162578650013956154779559962936558235847864676250787149677973037155754572123552662048761330289226141167641708444550944783565733312174411831602455187585645867987694560088894019633038130261626389 # 31479823396757^19-1, difficulty: 256.46, skewness: 0.01, alpha: 0.00 # cost: 1.35513e+19, est. time: 6452.98 GHz days (not accurate yet!) skew: 139.27 c6: 1 c0: -31479823396757 Y1: 31195852758590190231949248764353333010093 Y0: -1 lss: 0 type: snfs rlim: 266000000 alim: 134000000 lpbr: 33 lpba: 33 mfbr: 66 mfba: 96 rlambda: 3.0 alambda: 3.7 For Q of 40-450M to start, correct? ETA: And still sieve on the algebraic side, correct? Last fiddled with by swellman on 2022-07-25 at 12:06
2022-07-25, 11:53   #90
charybdis

Apr 2020

52·37 Posts

Quote:
 Originally Posted by RichD The 300M yield seems to be an outlier, with the expected yield to be part way between 200M and 400M.

Quote:
 Would it be a good rule of thumb if the skew is less than, say 0.05, to perform the inversion? Another difficult poly for OPN would be for p^31-1 but not as drastic.
Theoretically it should be better to invert whenever skew is less than 1, but whether this actually matters is a function of how extreme the skew is and how hard the job is: both will tend to make the b values of the relations larger.

This doesn't actually have anything to do with the NFS algorithm itself, only a single limitation of the msieve code. A brief explanation: relations are given by (a,b) pairs, and a typical relation will have a/b of the same order of magnitude as the skew. Msieve is currently limited to b values at most 2^32, but there is no such limit on a. Inverting swaps a with b, so if the skew is less than 1 then inverting should reduce the number of relations thrown out by msieve. Though for skews not too far from 1, this is unlikely to matter much: e.g. this OPN job run on 15e with skew 0.24, where less than 0.01% of the relations were lost. On the other hand, here is one with skew 0.01 where almost 2% of the relations were thrown out. 31479823396757^19-1 is bigger and has an even more extreme skew so the losses would be greater than that.

Quote:
 Originally Posted by swellman So, for the record, we are enqueuing this with 15e: ...
Looks correct to me. The parameters don't need to change when you invert the polynomials, as you're mainly producing the exact same relations with the same norms, the only difference being that a and b have swapped.
You decide whether this counts as a "smaller number" that can go before 2,2862M

Quote:
 ETA: And still sieve on the algebraic side, correct?
Yes.

 2022-07-29, 17:46 #91 swellman     Jun 2012 23×13×37 Posts 11+8,550M QUEUED AS 11p8_550M 11+8,550M is a GNFS 195 composite from the HCN project ready for sieving on 15e. Code: n: 136288161210072395823013117019980969502173240018666412020739446651656793905151246496169927562302139212209956899378445233588256353492133274266113370748323615532523317306454641969468409364934537501 skew: 200515477.36 c0: -32242163876522035851665931660453021024510617584 c1: 9073984765321950964906593967605583729980 c2: 6549708452747032989837187045500 c3: -564303215770502934756051 c4: 332286224984506 c5: 4826640 Y0: -30914435748287354232384753627221472783 Y1: 6830632680016625778885277 # MurphyE (Bf=8.590e+09,Bg=4.295e+09,area=2.684e+16) = 9.779e-09 skew 200515477.36, size 4.142e-019, alpha -7.334, combined = 9.980e-015 rroots = 5 rlim: 266000000 alim: 134000000 lpbr: 33 lpba: 33 mfbr: 66 mfba: 96 rlambda: 3.0 alambda: 3.7 Results of test sieving on the algebraic side with Q in blocks of 1000: Code: MQ Norm_yield Speed (sec/rel) 20 1812 0.496 35 2194 0.427 50 2447 0.419 75 2376 0.472 100 2546 0.493 140 2461 0.472 180 2252 0.534 240 2053 0.520 300 1866 0.580 360 1767 0.600 420 1725 0.611 480 1637 0.700 Suggesting a sieving range for Q of 20-490M to generate 950M raw relations. Last fiddled with by swellman on 2022-08-01 at 11:21
 2022-07-30, 01:37 #92 VBCurtis     "Curtis" Feb 2005 Riverside, CA 3·1,877 Posts For gnfs jobs, qmax should be no more than 8 times qmin, otherwise the duplicate ratio gets so high as to make the lower-Q relations not worth gathering. Maybe start this job at Q= 60M? Or is my understanding (gleaned from CADO experiments) incomplete? Last fiddled with by VBCurtis on 2022-07-30 at 01:38
2022-07-30, 11:39   #93
swellman

Jun 2012

23·13·37 Posts

Quote:
 Originally Posted by VBCurtis For gnfs jobs, qmax should be no more than 8 times qmin, otherwise the duplicate ratio gets so high as to make the lower-Q relations not worth gathering. Maybe start this job at Q= 60M? Or is my understanding (gleaned from CADO experiments) incomplete?
I can’t speak to best practices in sieving with CADO, but experience has shown ggnfs results do not seem reliant on the qmax/qmin ratio.

 2022-08-02, 10:59 #94 RichD     Sep 2008 Kansas 22×3×317 Posts QUEUED AS 1888171_41m1 C239 from the OPN t600 file. Code: n: 96213951613469305231302231894763722298853923706881919967966443770584688870752537981009385374951754089030434734044104610926201077424443533921747920930246549621622346963452693177188213019619789319025026149312773142478891851859089959013724557 # 1888171^41-1, difficulty: 263.59, skewness: 11.12, alpha: 0.00 # cost: 2.3066e+19, est. time: 10983.79 GHz days (not accurate yet!) skew: 11.117 c6: 1 c0: -1888171 Y1: -1 Y0: 85563641971119684450629651781443451031149091 type: snfs rlim: 134000000 alim: 134000000 lpbr: 32 lpba: 32 mfbr: 64 mfba: 93 rlambda: 2.8 alambda: 3.5 I found out one needs to add the -v switch to the GGNFS sievers to get the additional information for normalization. With a more exact science I can use a smaller sieve interval which will save me tons of time on my C2D laptop. Trial sieving 2K blocks. Code:  Q Yield N-Yld 40M 5990 5800 70M 5282 5467 100M 5013 4948 200M 4250 4118 232M 4388 3829 Last fiddled with by swellman on 2022-08-02 at 13:17
 2022-08-05, 14:05 #95 charybdis     Apr 2020 52·37 Posts QUEUED AS 2_1443m1 2,1443- is a Cunningham composite of SNFS difficulty 290 from the recent base 2 extension. Hopefully this will be the last one that I have to send to 15e. Code: n: 14916922976842176669639475705469515012190536891037011036656143393536518151666274307635319497442835675117923217375851417102963789797694391510612078590311433370085309252348348391596546545270297055271396478769686564766226428432338972804920032231499823 skew: 1.08 type: snfs size: 290 c6: 4 c3: 2 c0: 1 Y1: 1 Y0: -1461501637330902918203684832716283019655932542976 rlim: 134000000 alim: 266000000 lpbr: 33 lpba: 33 mfbr: 96 mfba: 66 rlambda: 3.8 alambda: 2.6 Test-sieving 1k ranges on the rational side: Code: MQ Norm_yield Speed (sec/rel) 25 3093 0.134 40 3008 0.145 70 2643 0.168 100 2512 0.181 150 2013 0.228 200 1828 0.246 300 1567 0.278 400 1508 0.283 500 1329 0.314 600 1255 0.327 Suggest sieving 25-560M for 950M raw relations. Last fiddled with by swellman on 2022-08-05 at 14:22
 2022-08-08, 17:40 #96 kruoli     "Oliver" Sep 2017 Porta Westfalica, DE 1,321 Posts QUEUED AS 3_565p GCW 3,565+ is ready for sieving. Code: n: 3443671211875592673692410405878773741590128830637420629071903338802101552170315523638510310711142179327881242898400825308153469780588367727373519589991041267518970815116866106440572589 skew: 45005263.17 # skew by cownoise c0: -166073624299973756029181204680717636447622880 c1: 12672586061064920164358430844686067472 c2: 349011108967340959348153651598 c3: -14788811629198192142371 c4: 439757720590086 c5: 3492720 Y0: -250478543763798807115283741750404037 Y1: 24096991062348010806961 # MurphyE (Bf=8.590e+09,Bg=4.295e+09,area=5.469e+16) = 1.867e-08 # f(x) = 3492720*x^5+439757720590086*x^4-14788811629198192142371*x^3+349011108967340959348153651598*x^2+12672586061064920164358430844686067472*x-166073624299973756029181204680717636447622880 # g(x) = 24096991062348010806961*x-250478543763798807115283741750404037 rlim: 266000000 alim: 134000000 lpbr: 31 lpba: 32 mfbr: 62 mfba: 94 rlambda: 2.7 alambda: 3.5 Test sieving 1k ranges and normalizing gave: Code: Q norm. yield 30M 2180 40M 2235 70M 2321 125M 2229 175M 2025 225M 1745 300M 1639 Sieving from 30M-210M on the algebraic side should give around 370M raw relations. I will do the LA. Last fiddled with by kruoli on 2022-08-08 at 18:39 Reason: Omitted superfluous word.
 2022-08-10, 10:05 #97 kruoli     "Oliver" Sep 2017 Porta Westfalica, DE 1,321 Posts QUEUED AS 10_277m GCW 10,277- (C188 GNFS) is ready for sieving: Code: n: 10346906288308418154637357815932916737602636349051602874820552349773463555930995873832540659095439340742928616672122132398600658384185025923279034022311767253405048658347876100244912612609 skew: 6411780.37383 # skew by cownoise type: gnfs c0: -1545280909574661931755671438530522953271140 c1: -284528837209326587649391440411066113 c2: 15342760644173924075294924469 c3: 53422542002613561282002 c4: 7444023615806274 c5: -671766480 Y0: -916576447844309587301085488226030971 Y1: 379186263590257755049441 # MurphyE (Bf=8.590e+09,Bg=4.295e+09,area=5.469e+16) = 1.395e-08 # scored 2.82894726e-14 by cownoise # f(x) = -671766480*x^5+7444023615806274*x^4+53422542002613561282002*x^3+15342760644173924075294924469*x^2-284528837209326587649391440411066113*x-1545280909574661931755671438530522953271140 # g(x) = 379186263590257755049441*x-916576447844309587301085488226030971 rlim: 266000000 alim: 134000000 lpbr: 32 lpba: 32 mfbr: 64 mfba: 94 lss: 0 rlambda: 2.8 alambda: 3.5 Test sieving 1k ranges and normalizing gave: Code: Q norm. yield 35M 2128 40M 2121 70M 2165 125M 2119 200M 1864 300M 1546 Sieving from 35M-275M on the algebraic side should give around 470M raw relations. I will do the LA. Last fiddled with by swellman on 2022-08-10 at 12:39
 2022-08-14, 09:43 #98 unconnected     May 2009 Moscow, Russia 33×107 Posts QUEUED AS C186_933436_12612 C186 from 933436:i12612 for 15e queue: Code: n: 268122889478028298755689271666314793363252818657940823233461616255623056680956479871977028159422090514406704183590678406934517962980756137458860542018709710214742647672123344227928654081 # norm 3.742754e-18 alpha -7.935221 e 3.438e-14 rroots 5 skew: 207490587.75 c0: 38170573534334446585237756207909423136814307135 c1: 581841713472748961318528209461747286867 c2: -11832725730178702659350046327181 c3: -33384625446095806142251 c4: 314947443047070 c5: 298200 Y0: -978960681695788806147626971164295158 Y1: 9918096082374422917 rlim: 266000000 alim: 134000000 lpbr: 32 lpba: 32 mfbr: 64 mfba: 94 rlambda: 2.8 alambda: 3.5 type: gnfs lss: 0 Suggesting sieve range is 30M-250M, this should produce ~470M raw relations. Last fiddled with by swellman on 2022-08-14 at 13:15
 2022-08-21, 06:05 #99 pinhodecarlos     "Carlos Pinho" Oct 2011 Milton Keynes, UK 23×641 Posts Hey guys, thank you so much for keeping this queue loaded. I need a favour. There are thousands of cores only allocated to this queue who are idle. Can we move one of the 16e smaller numbers (C214_139_87) here taking into consideration that each Wu's should fit under 1GB/thread. Thank you.

 Similar Threads Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post VBCurtis NFS@Home 170 2023-01-02 15:27 swellman NFS@Home 186 2022-12-29 17:58 VBCurtis NFS@Home 154 2022-12-23 21:35 VBCurtis NFS@Home 254 2022-01-02 01:59 debrouxl NFS@Home 10 2018-05-06 21:05

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