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Old 2008-08-10, 18:40   #1
nuggetprime
 
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Default Looking for ECPP software

Don't know if this is the right forum,but I'm looking for an opensource ECPP implementation. As you know, Morain's ECPP is properitary, and Primo is also properitary and for Windows only.

Regards,
nugget
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Old 2008-08-10, 20:19   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nuggetprime View Post
Don't know if this is the right forum,but I'm looking for an opensource ECPP implementation. As you know, Morain's ECPP is properitary, and Primo is also properitary and for Windows only.

Regards,
nugget
I'm not aware of any, but I agree that it would be nice if there were an open source implementation of ECPP.
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Old 2008-08-10, 21:24   #3
jasonp
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I'm not aware of any, but I agree that it would be nice if there were an open source implementation of ECPP.
Apparently Primo started off as sharware (and open source?) but the author had to change that because he indavertently infringed on a company's US patents. See here for more details.

Unfortunately, building elliptic curve code requires traversing a more-dangerous-than-usual intellectual property minefield.
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Old 2008-08-11, 00:55   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jasonp View Post
Apparently Primo started off as sharware (and open source?) but the author had to change that because he indavertently infringed on a company's US patents. See here for more details.

Unfortunately, building elliptic curve code requires traversing a more-dangerous-than-usual intellectual property minefield.
Ah yes, I had forgotten about that, although I don't recall it being open source.
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Old 2008-08-11, 04:19   #5
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I think Primo is no longer restricted. The only reference I could find is this one:


http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/p.../message/18405
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Old 2008-08-26, 10:00   #6
ixfd64
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Is the ECPP algorithm patented or something?
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Old 2008-08-26, 10:30   #7
nuggetprime
 
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Aren't mp3-audio,mpeg-video and so also patented?
Why then there exists some open source software like lame or ffmpeg doing the job?

--nugget
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Old 2008-08-26, 11:05   #8
R.D. Silverman
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nuggetprime View Post
Don't know if this is the right forum,but I'm looking for an opensource ECPP implementation. As you know, Morain's ECPP is properitary, and Primo is also properitary and for Windows only.

Regards,
nugget

Why not write your own? It isn't that difficult. ECPP is a lot easier than
APR-CL (aka cyclotomy tests).
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Old 2008-08-26, 11:06   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jasonp View Post
Apparently Primo started off as sharware (and open source?) but the author had to change that because he indavertently infringed on a company's US patents. See here for more details.

Unfortunately, building elliptic curve code requires traversing a more-dangerous-than-usual intellectual property minefield.
If it is for research purposes, the patents do not apply.
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Old 2008-08-26, 11:22   #10
xilman
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Quote:
Originally Posted by R.D. Silverman View Post
If it is for research purposes, the patents do not apply.
Now that is interesting. That would appear to be another difference between US patent law and that of (at least some of) the rest of the world. The well-known differences are, of course, the "first to file" and "first to invent" and the period for which a patent may still be applied after disclosure of the invention.

In the UK and, I believe, the rest of Europe building a patented invention without license from the patent holder is an offense regardless of intended purpose. At least, that's what I seem to remember MSFT's IP lawyers telling me.

Paul
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Old 2008-08-26, 16:46   #11
jasonp
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Quote:
Originally Posted by R.D. Silverman View Post
If it is for research purposes, the patents do not apply.
Are you sure? I would have thought that any public work incorporating a patented idea, whether for money or not, would be a violation of the terms of the patent. In the case of (the library used by) Primo, the author apparently came up with a cheap elliptic curve doubling technique that a US company had already patented, and had to stop (rightly or wrongly) in the face of threatened legal action. Distributing the work is what seems to cause trouble.

With the DMCA it's even murkier; there's an exception in the law that allows researchers to break commercial copyright protection schemes, but the exception doesn't let researchers publish their results.

My understanding of the elliptic curve business is that there are a lot of different patents, for different types of curves, curve arithmetic, and curve applications like crypto schemes

PS: further reading on ECC patents

Last fiddled with by jasonp on 2008-08-26 at 17:01
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