Cost of electricity -- compute for heat only - Page 2

ATH · 2021-09-24, 21:24

I just got an email from the power company where they are warning me that prices are going up. The next 3 months could be 30% higher than the same period last year, and that is saying something, as I have ranted many times about the power prices here in Denmark.

M344587487 · 2021-09-25, 07:03

The best time to supplement a grid supply with DIY renewables was years ago, the second best time is now right before every other bugger figures it out.

Uncwilly · 2021-09-25, 15:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by M344587487

The best time to supplement a grid supply with DIY renewables was years ago, the second best time is now right before every other bugger figures it out.

The easiest DIY for solar is a system that allows users to plug the panels into a standard AC outlet to backfeed the grid. The prongs are not live until the controller senses the wall power. They can be strung together. No electrician is required.

dcheuk · 2021-09-25, 16:14

Just moved from the north to FL. I thought I was about to go broke because of AC bill. In PA whenever I uses AC in the summer my electric bill goes sky high (effective rate was about 0.24/kWh) but in contrary my electric bill in FL was much cheaper even though I cranked central AC 24/7. Anyways looking forward to winter as I doubt I'll need heat in florida.

Our utilities provider (the city itself) gave us two options: (i) flat rate of 0.1244/kWh or (ii) 0.0574/kWh 7pm-7am + 0.2198/kWh 7am-7pm. The city utilities also said they are committing to go 100% clean, renewable energy by ........ 2050 lol. Hopefully by then it still matters.

kriesel · 2021-09-25, 17:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Uncwilly

The easiest DIY for solar is a system that allows users to plug the panels into a standard AC outlet to backfeed the grid. The prongs are not live until the controller senses the wall power. They can be strung together. No electrician is required.

Who's selling such hardware? I've never seen that.

a1call · 2021-09-25, 17:15

Quote:

A May 2015 article in Forbes magazine calculated that using a Tesla Powerwall 1 model combined with solar panels in a home would cost 30 cents/kWh for electricity if a home remains connected to the grid (the article acknowledges that the Tesla battery could make economic sense in applications that are entirely off-grid). US consumers got electricity from the power grid for 12.5 cents/kWh on average. The article concluded the "...Tesla's Powerwall Is Just Another Toy For Rich Green People.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tesla_Powerwall

kriesel · 2021-09-25, 17:51

I recently looked at what would be involved in getting a rooftop solar array approved and installed. The regs here require approval of plans by the local electric utility monopoly, specify net metering, and selling excess power into the grid past the home's monthly usage (negative net usage, feeding the grid on average) pays ~1/4 the cost to purchase power from the utility, provision of documentation to the utility and IIRC local government, etc. Liability insurance is also required; no idea what that costs. Coverage for hail and wind damage to panels may vary. https://www.progressive.com/answers/...-solar-panels/ https://www.nationwide.com/lc/resour...anel-insurance https://www.travelers.com/business-i...le/solar-power Adding lightning rods and other protection might be advisable, since a panel array and its framing is a big electrical circuit on top of the house.

Uncwilly · 2021-09-25, 18:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by kriesel

Who's selling such hardware? I've never seen that.

I found this:
https://pluggedsolar.com/expandable-...-solar-panels/
I searched "plug in solar". I saw a product at a local "state fair" type event several years ago. The system that I saw could handle multiple panels. And if you know your home circuits you could distribute them on different breakers.

kriesel · 2021-09-25, 18:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by Uncwilly

I found this

Thx. That firm's in Texas. Regs vary by state. I have a little array on my deck, but it's an isolated 12Vdc system. Does an ok job of providing a bit of direct DC lighting, spare battery charging, or rarely powering a small inverter. No grid tie regs issue because it's completely isolated.
For what little power per unit area/year would be produced, here in WI, it looks like a lot of time, cost, learning curve, hassle and liability for little savings.

pinhodecarlos · 2021-09-25, 18:59

Don’t forget you will need also to request for a roof survey to understand if the extra load can be handle by your home. This should account for rooftop structure, snow forecast, water ingress forecast, wind loads, etc. I would also advice to get the solar PV inverter online, wired to Ethernet, to reduce servicing since the majority of a solar PV issues can be easily fixed this way, like rearranging strings, detection of optimiser issues, etc.

JWNoctis · 2021-09-26, 06:09

Actually had a silly idea of running custom loops into water heater tank in place of a solar thermal panel. Don't actually try that at home though, since it'd probably violate more codes than an unshuttered and readily flammable universal power socket hanging by its aluminium wire, which is also wired in reverse and without grounding.

But if your system is consuming enough power to be useful as heating, it's probably also running well above its best efficiency point, server farms and multi-GPU crunchers excluded.

For the good old single-socket home PC though, the best efficiency point now usually comes in at something under 5W per physical core for the common latest-generation processor, and typical Prime95/mprime load, in my limited experience.

2021-09-24, 21:24	#12
ATH Einyen Dec 2003 Denmark 2×17×101 Posts	I just got an email from the power company where they are warning me that prices are going up. The next 3 months could be 30% higher than the same period last year, and that is saying something, as I have ranted many times about the power prices here in Denmark. Last fiddled with by ATH on 2021-09-24 at 21:28

2021-09-25, 17:51	#18
kriesel "TF79LL86GIMPS96gpu17" Mar 2017 US midwest 2×29×127 Posts	I recently looked at what would be involved in getting a rooftop solar array approved and installed. The regs here require approval of plans by the local electric utility monopoly, specify net metering, and selling excess power into the grid past the home's monthly usage (negative net usage, feeding the grid on average) pays ~1/4 the cost to purchase power from the utility, provision of documentation to the utility and IIRC local government, etc. Liability insurance is also required; no idea what that costs. Coverage for hail and wind damage to panels may vary. https://www.progressive.com/answers/...-solar-panels/ https://www.nationwide.com/lc/resour...anel-insurance https://www.travelers.com/business-i...le/solar-power Adding lightning rods and other protection might be advisable, since a panel array and its framing is a big electrical circuit on top of the house. Last fiddled with by kriesel on 2021-09-25 at 17:55

2021-09-26, 06:09	#22
JWNoctis "J. W." Aug 2021 5·7 Posts	Actually had a silly idea of running custom loops into water heater tank in place of a solar thermal panel. Don't actually try that at home though, since it'd probably violate more codes than an unshuttered and readily flammable universal power socket hanging by its aluminium wire, which is also wired in reverse and without grounding. But if your system is consuming enough power to be useful as heating, it's probably also running well above its best efficiency point, server farms and multi-GPU crunchers excluded. For the good old single-socket home PC though, the best efficiency point now usually comes in at something under 5W per physical core for the common latest-generation processor, and typical Prime95/mprime load, in my limited experience. Last fiddled with by JWNoctis on 2021-09-26 at 06:10

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2021-09-25, 07:03	#13
M344587487 "Composite as Heck" Oct 2017 3·311 Posts	The best time to supplement a grid supply with DIY renewables was years ago, the second best time is now right before every other bugger figures it out.

2021-09-25, 16:14	#15
dcheuk Jan 2019 Florida 3⁵ Posts	Just moved from the north to FL. I thought I was about to go broke because of AC bill. In PA whenever I uses AC in the summer my electric bill goes sky high (effective rate was about 0.24/kWh) but in contrary my electric bill in FL was much cheaper even though I cranked central AC 24/7. Anyways looking forward to winter as I doubt I'll need heat in florida. Our utilities provider (the city itself) gave us two options: (i) flat rate of 0.1244/kWh or (ii) 0.0574/kWh 7pm-7am + 0.2198/kWh 7am-7pm. The city utilities also said they are committing to go 100% clean, renewable energy by ........ 2050 lol. Hopefully by then it still matters.

2021-09-25, 18:59	#21
pinhodecarlos "Carlos Pinho" Oct 2011 Milton Keynes, UK 2³·641 Posts	Don’t forget you will need also to request for a roof survey to understand if the extra load can be handle by your home. This should account for rooftop structure, snow forecast, water ingress forecast, wind loads, etc. I would also advice to get the solar PV inverter online, wired to Ethernet, to reduce servicing since the majority of a solar PV issues can be easily fixed this way, like rearranging strings, detection of optimiser issues, etc.