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Old 2008-12-27, 15:28   #177
Flatlander
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I'm fiddling with a little program that compares a file of candidates with a file of primes and outputs a file with the remaining ks? (It's very specific to this conjecture.)
I have it working but I'm going to refine it. Which format do you prefer for remaining ks?

xxxxxxxx
yyyyyyy
zzzzzzzz
or
xxxxxxxx*3^n-1
yyyyyyy*3^n-1
zzzzzzzz*3^n-1

Last fiddled with by Flatlander on 2008-12-27 at 15:36
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Old 2008-12-27, 18:55   #178
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flatlander View Post
I'm fiddling with a little program that compares a file of candidates with a file of primes and outputs a file with the remaining ks? (It's very specific to this conjecture.)
I have it working but I'm going to refine it. Which format do you prefer for remaining ks?

xxxxxxxx
yyyyyyy
zzzzzzzz
or
xxxxxxxx*3^n-1
yyyyyyy*3^n-1
zzzzzzzz*3^n-1

The first one. I can quickly concatenate it into a bunch of k's to list on the web pages.


Gary
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Old 2008-12-28, 11:08   #179
jasong
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gd_barnes View Post
I believe this is a hopeless cause and am unreserving the range because I would want others to double-check your effort anyway.

Clearly, you don't know what you're doing and you STILL haven't answered my question as to why you reserved such a large range for one of the most difficult efforts on this project.

The fact that it interferes with your online gaming indicates little dedication to accurately completing the range.

Please find an easier effort here or another project to work on.


Gary
DO NOT unreserve my range, I intend to complete it. As for my "gaming addiction" there are plenty of people who don't like to run DCing projects ALL THE TIME.

With all due respect, I feel like I am being DISRESPECTED. If my range ends up being a mish-mashed piece of crap then don't accept it, but don't just unreserve it on a whim.

Edit: How about I send you what I've already done so you know I'm reliable? I've had to restart my machine at least once since I started, meaning an edit to one of the files. So if you find any mistakes(which I don't think you will), than you can tell me to give it up and I'll do something else.

Sound fair?

Last fiddled with by jasong on 2008-12-28 at 11:23
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Old 2008-12-29, 06:06   #180
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jasong View Post
DO NOT unreserve my range, I intend to complete it. As for my "gaming addiction" there are plenty of people who don't like to run DCing projects ALL THE TIME.

With all due respect, I feel like I am being DISRESPECTED. If my range ends up being a mish-mashed piece of crap then don't accept it, but don't just unreserve it on a whim.

Edit: How about I send you what I've already done so you know I'm reliable? I've had to restart my machine at least once since I started, meaning an edit to one of the files. So if you find any mistakes(which I don't think you will), than you can tell me to give it up and I'll do something else.

Sound fair?
Yes, you are being disrespected and I'm intentionally doing so because you refuse to answer my questions so I'll ask them a 3rd time below. It's not a whim that I've unreserved your range as you'll see below.

What irritates me so much about this, Jason, is not so much that you took on one of the most difficult efforts here while knowing little about it, it's that you reserved such a HUGE range on one of the most difficult efforts and proceeded to inspire no confidence in your manner of attacking it. That after you reserved a huge sieving range at NPLB and messed it up badly after messing up your LLRing range. The sieving mess delayed us nearly 2 weeks on that sieving drive as we piece-mealed together to find out what ranges that you had left undone, which were many of them. You reserved nearly half of the range that we had in the entire sieving drive. I and several others were not happy at all.

On this effort, you initially indicated that you would try to "daisy chain" sieve (whatever that means) using NewPGen before finding out that you needed to use srsieve. You have had to restart twice, missed the very elementary PFGW switch -f, and didn't have it stop after finding one prime for each k, another very elementary mistake. You also gave a 2.5-day estimate for at least a 30-day effort on 2 cores. You'll have to excuse me if you don't inspire any confidence nor respect after that and the NPLB mess.

Back to your post: I won't be able to judge how accurate you are until I see you complete at least part of the range to n=25K. Do you have any part of the range complete to n=25K yet? It's easy to use PFGW to get it up to n=2.5K or 5K or 10K. Making the transition to the sieving and LLRing/Phroting for n=2.5K-25K (or 5K-25K or 10K-25K) is not easy at all unless you know exactly what you are doing. If you're still PFGWing, me checking you won't give me any confidence that you will correctly make the transition to the higher n-range.

I'll tell you what, I will re-reserve the range for you on one condition only: I will ask for the THIRD time and I expect an answer this time:

1. Why have you chosen one of the most difficult efforts at CRUS?

2. Why have you reserved such a huge range? Why not just try k=700M-710M? There would be no problem finishing that in 3-4 days on 2 cores.

One more question that I want answered but you never did so satisfactorily:

How do you intend to attack this, what is your estimated completion date, and how did you arrive at your estimate? I need exact details that might look something like:
1. PFGW all k's to n=5K using the -f switch.
2. Use xxxx script/program/process to compare primes found to total k's in the range to determine k's remaining.
3. Use k's remaining from #2 to sieve n=5K-25K using srsieve. (Note: Please state HOW you will use srsieve...that is the switches you will use and the input file that you will use.)
4. Use Phrot to test k's remaining for n=5K-25K.
5. Estimated completion is Jan. 30th. It took me X days to complete an k=10M range to n=25K therefore, it should take 10X days to complete the k=100M range to n=25K.

That is not the method that I recommend nor necessarily a reasonable estimate but it is the level of detail that I need to know that you understand what you are doing.

Answering those questions will force you to plan ahead, which is what is needed on a difficult effort like this. This is not something that you can do a whim like many efforts.

If you fail to answer the questions again, regardless of your response, I will ask one more time. Fail again and I will not read your future posts about this effort because I won't think you're serious about doing this correctly. That's 5 total times that I'll ask the same questions. I think that's more than fair. I hope you do the right thing with your next response.

If the idea of these conjectures interests you, why not reserve some files from one of our pre-existing drives? We have plenty of them and if you reserve small ranges that would take less than one week on 1-2 cores, I won't ask any questions.


Gary

Last fiddled with by gd_barnes on 2008-12-29 at 06:25
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Old 2008-12-29, 16:56   #181
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Status for Riesel base 3 k>100M to k<200M:

Core 1: n=61078 (67 PRPs found)
Core 2: n=68871 (79 PRPs found)
Core 3: n=54007 (51 PRPs found)
Core 4: n=57834 (54 PRPs found)

+ 16 additional PRPs for the n=25001 to n=26000 range.

A total of PRPs out of 490 possible is found. Less than 250000 tests remain. ETA is 4-6 weeks, maybe less since now a total of 4 commited cores on the Quad has been reinstated for this particular challenge.

Regards

KEP

EDIT: k=3677878 is still at n=298000 and testings is not scheduled to begin for earliest 1 week from now! (~13550 remain)

Last fiddled with by KEP on 2008-12-29 at 16:59
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Old 2008-12-29, 21:09   #182
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I have had very little time due to work-issues (moving a whole shop around, moving another one to a new location, and now, a few days more worth of counting every item we have in stock. (with an approx count of 80k items...)

Status now:
done upto 550M,
550-560M done, but need to do the accounting,
560-600M done upto 2k
560-570M sieving done




Quote:
Originally Posted by gd_barnes View Post
Micha,

What is the status of your k=520M-600M range? There has been no word on it since Nov. 15th.


Chris,

What is the status of your k=660M-700M range?



Thanks,
Gary
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Old 2008-12-30, 05:08   #183
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gd_barnes View Post
On this effort, you initially indicated that you would try to "daisy chain" sieve (whatever that means) using NewPGen before finding out that you needed to use srsieve.
NewPGen, even though it isn't documented, accepts command-line arguments in Windows. I was going to ask a friend of mine to help me make a script to do this. This is before I discovered that a script was already made.

Quote:
Back to your post: I won't be able to judge how accurate you are until I see you complete at least part of the range to n=25K. Do you have any part of the range complete to n=25K yet? It's easy to use PFGW to get it up to n=2.5K or 5K or 10K. Making the transition to the sieving and LLRing/Phroting for n=2.5K-25K (or 5K-25K or 10K-25K) is not easy at all unless you know exactly what you are doing. If you're still PFGWing, me checking you won't give me any confidence that you will correctly make the transition to the higher n-range.
Since Windows doesn't seem to have any good programs for dealing with large text files, and since my Linux laptop has kicked the bucket(hopefully, only temporarily) I am forced to use indirect methods to gauge my progress. I've calculated that when my range is finished, I will have a little over 415,000kB of data. Right now, I have about 87,000kB of data, plus whatever is still in the write cache. I have no idea when I will finish, but I'll stick with it.

Quote:
I'll tell you what, I will re-reserve the range for you on one condition only: I will ask for the THIRD time and I expect an answer this time:

1. Why have you chosen one of the most difficult efforts at CRUS?
I mean this with the utmost respect, my apology will come at the end of the message, but...I am not a stupid person. I am not accusing you of calling me stupid or insulting me, even though I'm sure many people on Mersenne Forum think I'm an idiot. Between the time of the fiasco with NPLB range(I think that was the project affected) and now, I have had the opportunity to start on, and adjust to, a new psychiatric medication. Despite the fact that I've been away from psychiatric hospitals for about a decade, it is only recently that I found a medication that causes me to be consistently stable and, to be honest, not as much of an ass.(I hope) I believe I am now capable of handling complex tasks, such as baby-sitting one of these ranges. I still have crazy moments, but now the come less frequently and it's easier for me to come down from them.

I intend to be very careful with this range and do my best(high chance of success, in my opinion) to make 4 sub-range files of first prime below n=25,000 for each k in my range.

I will then compress these large files, along with a list of the remaining ks and email them to the required address.

Quote:
2. Why have you reserved such a huge range? Why not just try k=700M-710M? There would be no problem finishing that in 3-4 days on 2 cores.
That's a good question. Honestly, while you may not like this, I intended to run it for a few days to see how long it would take, and then possibly unreserve a chunk. Hindsight tells me this was disrespectful, and I'm sorry, but I do intend to complete the range as reserved.

Quote:
One more question that I want answered but you never did so satisfactorily:

How do you intend to attack this, what is your estimated completion date, and how did you arrive at your estimate? I need exact details that might look something like:
I do not know the completion date, I intend to figure it out in the next few days. But I'm fairly certain it will be completed before the end of January. IT IS a huge range, but no worse than the situation with first-pass Mersenne numbers. I intend to complete it
Quote:
1. PFGW all k's to n=5K using the -f switch.
PFGW all k's to n=25K using the -f switch. <--
Quote:
2. Use xxxx script/program/process to compare primes found to total k's in the range to determine k's remaining.
I barely have the skills to verify this stuff, I'm hoping it can be done when I report them. Unless I'm totally confused about the instructions I found in this forum, all the ks should be accounted for in the eight files I send, 4 sub-ranges of my range with found primes, and 4 files for ks that have no prime n below n=25,000 for the same range.
Quote:
3. Use k's remaining from #2 to sieve n=5K-25K using srsieve. (Note: Please state HOW you will use srsieve...that is the switches you will use and the input file that you will use.)
Actually, there are a couple things I could do. As I said earlier, Windows NewPGen has an undocumented command-line feature. I think it would be best to use a script to systematically take the unprimed ks to 1G with NewPGen, then combine the files with srfile and sieve the resulting file until I've got a good rate of n removal, at which point I'll post on the forum to see what the project wants me to do with the file after that.(I might do things differently, I'll be sure to clarify things when I submit my range.)
Quote:
4. Use Phrot to test k's remaining for n=5K-25K.
I've never used Phrot. As high as n=25,000 is, which is what I'm doing, I think LLR would suffice.
Quote:
5. Estimated completion is Jan. 30th. It took me X days to complete an k=10M range to n=25K therefore, it should take 10X days to complete the k=100M range to n=25K.
January 30 is the date you confiscate my reservation if it hasn't been returned. Does that sound good? :)

Quote:
Gary
Thank you for you patience, I'm sorry if we got off on the wrong foot.

I know I promised an apology here, but I can't seem to come up with the words here. Truthfully, even though I've been rude to you in the past week, you are one of the more well mannered people on this Forum. Honestly, I somehow find the values I admire in meatspace reprehensible in cyberspace. Until I have time to think about things, of course.

HAVE A GREAT DAY!!! :)
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Old 2008-12-30, 12:01   #184
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Well, Jason, you've answered my questions and I thank you. Answered, yes; satisfactorally, not really.

Despite how disrespectful I've been towards you, it's clear to me that you are not stupid...just unfocused and extremely disorganized. I've read some of your posts in other forums and you have some math skills. The problem is that if it's a difficult effort, you have to take the time to learn about it and that can require a lot of focus and a fair amount of organization by taking notes, saving links, etc. Sometimes learning about something and becoming more organized can get boring but when you're done, all of a sudden, it becomes more fun because you can do it right the first time!

Unfortunately there isn't really much that you wrote here that convinces me that you can give an accurate accounting of all of the k's in 30 days.

Are you really going to use PFGW to test every k to n=25000? If so, you're in trouble. The effort will take you months! You have to sieve and then run LLR or Phrot for the higher n-ranges. Trial factoring with the -f switch in PFGW will be far too slow for such a large k-range. I admit that I did just that for a k=10M range because I wanted to start it and forget it but I wouldn't dream of doing it for a k=100M range.

One thing I should warn you about PFGW: If you are telling it to stop processing a k when it finds a prime for the k (which you should), if you stop PFGW in the middle, it will NOT remember the k's that it has found primes for when you restart it. This can mess you up big! For that reason, I recommend doing one k to n=25K, the next k to n=25K, and so on instead of progressing upwards by n-value on all k's at once. If you have to restart, it's a quick change to the PFGW script to make it start at the k where it left off.

I need one more thing from you:

What is your current status? Let me give more detail:

I think you said you were running 2 cores so...
Please look in your 2 PFGW GUI windows and tell me what they say. By that I mean:
1. What k is it processing and what n-value is it at?
-or-
2. If it is scrolling thru the ranges too fast to see, please tell me what the last 3-PRP that it found is.

One of those two things will tell me just about all that I need to know. With that info., I can likely calculate a nearly exact estimated completion date for you.

If you give me that last bit of info., I'll be glad to reserve it for you until Jan. 31st; a few extra days even. I'll say this: I don't believe it is possible to get there using only PFGW unless you put a lot more than 2 cores on it.

Also, I may ask for that last bit of info. 1-2 times a week to make sure that you are progressing at a rate that would allow completion in the amount of time that you think it should.


Gary
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Old 2008-12-30, 12:14   #185
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KEP View Post
Status for Riesel base 3 k>100M to k<200M:

Core 1: n=61078 (67 PRPs found)
Core 2: n=68871 (79 PRPs found)
Core 3: n=54007 (51 PRPs found)
Core 4: n=57834 (54 PRPs found)

+ 16 additional PRPs for the n=25001 to n=26000 range.

A total of PRPs out of 490 possible is found. Less than 250000 tests remain. ETA is 4-6 weeks, maybe less since now a total of 4 commited cores on the Quad has been reinstated for this particular challenge.

Regards

KEP

EDIT: k=3677878 is still at n=298000 and testings is not scheduled to begin for earliest 1 week from now! (~13550 remain)

Thanks for the update and nice progress on k=100M-200M!

Kenneth, if you can forward me your primes at this point, that would help me out. I'm trying to encourage people to post statuses more frequently on efforts where a lot of primes are being found. Having them broken up in smaller pieces allows me to not get so far behind all at once in keeping the pages updated.

Without the primes, I can't reflect any n-range status updates on the pages because they would be out of sync with the primes and k's remaining.

Thanks!


Gary
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Old 2008-12-30, 12:17   #186
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Quote:
Originally Posted by michaf View Post
I have had very little time due to work-issues (moving a whole shop around, moving another one to a new location, and now, a few days more worth of counting every item we have in stock. (with an approx count of 80k items...)

Status now:
done upto 550M,
550-560M done, but need to do the accounting,
560-600M done upto 2k
560-570M sieving done

Micha,

Thanks for the update.

Can you send me your primes and k's remaining up to k=550M right now? Like I was saying to Kenneth in the last post, it helps me keep from getting too far behind on verification and udpating of the pages for efforts with a lot of primes and k's.


Thanks,
Gary
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Old 2008-12-30, 15:04   #187
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gd_barnes View Post
Thanks for the update and nice progress on k=100M-200M!

Kenneth, if you can forward me your primes at this point, that would help me out. I'm trying to encourage people to post statuses more frequently on efforts where a lot of primes are being found. Having them broken up in smaller pieces allows me to not get so far behind all at once in keeping the pages updated.

Without the primes, I can't reflect any n-range status updates on the pages because they would be out of sync with the primes and k's remaining.

Thanks!


Gary

I can send you the primes as soon as I've the PRPs verified. Thanks for reminding me of having to send you the primes from time to time. I expect to find a total of 368 primes out of 490 possible. But in stead of yaping I should be getting to verify the PRPs.

Take care everyone!

Kenneth!
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