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Old 2020-03-23, 22:09   #45
retina
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xilman View Post
Incidentally, drinking 96% ethanol is an acquired skill. No-one IME knows how to do it without practice.
That isn't a skill I care to develop.
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Old 2020-03-23, 22:47   #46
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Originally Posted by retina View Post
That isn't a skill I care to develop.
I rely on my liver to do it for me. Am I doing it wrong?

BTW, if Paul really is as skilled at ingesting the 96% stuff as he claims, I suggest a knighthood be bestowed on him, with title "Sir Osis of Liver".

Last fiddled with by ewmayer on 2020-03-23 at 22:49
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Old 2020-03-24, 00:16   #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xilman View Post
I was a chemist in a previous life and have had significant experience in the procedure. That's why I know that a 96% ethanol / 4% water mix is almost always safer to drink than anything stronger.

Incidentally, drinking 96% ethanol is an acquired skill. No-one IME knows how to do it without practice.
Har. Everclear (95% ethanol, 190 proof) is as pure as you can distill it. Getting the remaining water out requires a different method.

If you insist on drinking Everclear straight ("neat"), I would advise taking very small sips. I experimented once, and I am glad of my gingerly caution.

Purer-than-95% ethanol would definitely suck water from any tissues in your mouth it touched, possibly causing blisters.

In the spreading metropolis of Hyder, Alaska, they invite you to get "Hyderized" at the Glacier Inn by downing a shot of what they say is Everclear, but which they also say is 150 proof. Perhaps it's diluted a bit.

I know from a long-ago experience, during lunch on my last day at a summer job, that pure Bacardi 151 (151 proof) is a shock to the inside of the mouth. I was obliged to take a sip of it straight, before being allowed to dilute a goodly slug of the stuff in a can of cold Coca-Cola. That was Bacardi Silver 151, which I haven't seen in a long, long time. They still make an amber-colored 151. It has all kinds of flammability warnings on the bottle.
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Old 2020-03-24, 00:52   #48
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Goldman Sachs says one should buy Boing stocks now:
https://www.investors.com/news/boein...sachs-upgrade/

I am no expert but think that Boing will be interesting in a few weeks or months; now is far too early. Goldman Sachs' proposal sounds like absolute gambling to me.
It seems really unlikely that Boeing will turn around this quickly. They've got too much sh!t on their plate just now. This seems like a broker trying to pump up commissions.
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Old 2020-03-24, 02:58   #49
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Originally Posted by ewmayer View Post
"Sir Osis of Liver".
Hahaha, I can't stop laughing (tho I have to accept it took me a while to get that!)
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Old 2020-03-24, 03:49   #50
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Hahaha, I can't stop laughing (tho I have to accept it took me a while to get that!)
Me too. On all counts.
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Old 2020-03-24, 07:47   #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ewmayer View Post
I rely on my liver to do it for me. Am I doing it wrong?

BTW, if Paul really is as skilled at ingesting the 96% stuff as he claims, I suggest a knighthood be bestowed on him, with title "Sir Osis of Liver".
Nice gag, but knighthoods don't have the "of blah" appendage. That is reserved for peerages.

Lord Osis of Liver doesn't really work.

Last fiddled with by xilman on 2020-03-24 at 07:59
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Old 2020-03-24, 07:58   #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Sardonicus View Post
Har. Everclear (95% ethanol, 190 proof) is as pure as you can distill it. Getting the remaining water out requires a different method.

If you insist on drinking Everclear straight ("neat"), I would advise taking very small sips. I experimented once, and I am glad of my gingerly caution.

Purer-than-95% ethanol would definitely suck water from any tissues in your mouth it touched, possibly causing blisters.

In the spreading metropolis of Hyder, Alaska, they invite you to get "Hyderized" at the Glacier Inn by downing a shot of what they say is Everclear, but which they also say is 150 proof. Perhaps it's diluted a bit.

I know from a long-ago experience, during lunch on my last day at a summer job, that pure Bacardi 151 (151 proof) is a shock to the inside of the mouth. I was obliged to take a sip of it straight, before being allowed to dilute a goodly slug of the stuff in a can of cold Coca-Cola. That was Bacardi Silver 151, which I haven't seen in a long, long time. They still make an amber-colored 151. It has all kinds of flammability warnings on the bottle.
The effect on the mouth if drinking >99.9% ethanol is indistinguishable from that of 95%. Trust me, I've performed the experiment. Dehydration but no blisters from either of them.

Bacardi 151 appears to be unobtainable in the UK and I've had to import it as my duty-free allowance on return flights from the US. The last time I drank any was at a FlyBase meeting in Cambridge (Mass, not UK). Some smart-arse (excuse me, smart-ass) post-doc challenged me to drink a shot. Another Brit also decided to give it a try. What the guy didn't know at the time was that I had had extensive practice drinking stuff at least that concentrated over the years. I downed mine in one (not the best way!) with ease and suggested that we had another. I then showed my colleague how to savour the drink properly (I'd warned her off starting straight away).

For strong booze here or in La Palma I'm restricted to absinthe. Some of those reach 85% or so, though 60-80% is more typical.

Putting spirits in Coke is anathema. They go to all that trouble to remove the water ...
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Old 2020-03-24, 08:09   #53
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Har. Everclear (95% ethanol, 190 proof) is as pure as you can distill it. Getting the remaining water out requires a different method.
Not true. "Rectified spirits" is 96% ethanol and is the constant boiling composition of an ethanol/water mixture. Incidentally, the figure differs according to whether it is measured by mass or by volume. 96% is an easily memorized figure between the other two.

The easiest way to make "absolute alcohol" is to add benzene and distill the mixture. The fraction which comes off is now ~99.9% ethanol, 0.1% water and a few ppm benzene. It is this latter component which makes drinking the product inadvisable.

To convert absolute alcohol to rectified spirits, add water and redistill. The benzene comes off in the first fraction, which should be discarded. After that comes the 96% component.

Please believe me, I know what I am talking about. Chemistry grad students were always very popular people at university parties.
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Old 2020-03-24, 09:04   #54
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Ha, I didn't expect my small/silly joke to give birth of such a serious discussion about chemistry. We used to run a "homemade" (own design) distillery to make "țuică" and "palincă" (from own grown plums, cherries, etc) when we lived in our parents' house, so, all these things are not foreign to us, we even knew how to break the azeotropic mixture of alcohol and water, but this only in theory. In our barn we could never distill anything higher than 70 or so, because we could not control the temperature like in a lab. Imagine a ~150 liters of diarrhea-looking mixture boiling in a big pot, over a big fire, and lots of pipes to take care of. But it did the job well (i.e. getting everybody around drunk )

In the Făgăraș mountains where we grew up, people use ball-shaped pottery made from special clay and burned in a special way, you put such ball into the barrel with fermenting fruits and let it over the winter, then in the spring is filled with alcohol, which passes through the walls, but the water can't pass. This always amazed me, because the water molecule is technically smaller than the alcohol molecule.

Last fiddled with by LaurV on 2020-03-24 at 09:23
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Old 2020-03-24, 13:38   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xilman View Post
Not true. "Rectified spirits" is 96% ethanol and is the constant boiling composition of an ethanol/water mixture. Incidentally, the figure differs according to whether it is measured by mass or by volume. 96% is an easily memorized figure between the other two.

The easiest way to make "absolute alcohol" is to add benzene and distill the mixture. The fraction which comes off is now ~99.9% ethanol, 0.1% water and a few ppm benzene. It is this latter component which makes drinking the product inadvisable.
You're quibbling about a fraction of a percent. A lot of sources truncate 95.63% ethanol in the azeotrope to 95%, also an easily-memorized figure. Go argue with them.

Everclear says 190 proof (95%) on the bottle; or at least it did last time I looked at an Everclear bottle. It's been a while. One bottle of Everclear, one clean empty bottle, and enough distilled water, makes two bottles of vodka.

I knew about redistilling with benzene to remove water (my dad, who had a degree in chemical engineering, told me). I simply never considered drinking alcohol treated that way. I would view it as "denatured."

Water is also removed by passing the azeotrope through a solid that latches on to the water molecules but not the alcohol. I've read about anything from zeolites (clay), to anhydrous calcium oxide, to rock salt, to starch being used for the purpose. The producers of corn ethanol for motor fuel sometimes use corn grits to remove water. The ethanol has to be denatured to qualify as industrial. Benzene can be used as both a denaturant, and as an agent to keep any residual water from separating.

Industrial (denatured) alcohol is sometimes sold as drinkable stuff by the unscrupulous. News reports come from India with distressing frequency of people at wedding parties being blinded or killed by the stuff. Methanol is the usual denaturant causing blindness.

Denatured alcohol also was sold to unwitting victims as drinkable in the US during Prohibition. As related in The Saturday Evening Post,
Quote:
The assistant secretary of the Treasury in charge of prohibition said that drinkers on the fringes of society were "dying off fast from poison 'hooch'." If the result of these deaths was a sober America, he said, "a good job will have been done."

The chief chemist for the prohibition unit said Americans couldn't possibly taste denatured alcohol without realizing it was unfit for consumption. Yet in 1923, he admitted to Time magazine that "it is impossible to detect wood alcohol except by a thorough chemical analysis performed by a skilled chemist in a well-equipped laboratory."

The poisonings soured many Americans on prohibition, and on the Anti-Saloon League. The League's chairman, Wayne Wheeler, responded to news of the poisonings by saying "the government is under no obligation to furnish people with alcohol that is drinkable when the Constitution prohibits it. The person who drinks this industrial alcohol is a deliberate suicide."
There is pure 200 proof drinkable ethanol available. It is not cheap. It also almost certainly does not remain 200 proof after being opened.
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