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 2014-05-31, 03:07 #1 Rodrigo     Jun 2010 Pennsylvania 16468 Posts Bitcoin miner for GIMPS... Just got the following ad from Memory Ten. Assuming that the GIMPS software existed for it, how much might this baby produce (LL, TF) on a per-day basis? 1.3THs...whoa, that's fast! New Visionman Prospector 1300 hashes stratum using 28nm technology Visionman continues to lead the pack in Bitcoin mining innovation with our new 28nm miners which operate at a blindingly fast rate of 1.3 THs, over six-times the speed of our previous generation miner. In the great Prospector tradition our new Model 1300 is designed to run stand-alone, just put it on your network, point your computer to the Prospector's IP address to configure your mining pool information and you are mining with one of the fastest machines on the planet. [In addition to Bitcoin, the Prospector 1300 will mine other SHA256 coins like Terracoin, Tigercoin and more! http://gallery.mailchimp.com/f31d888...f90444e2fb.jpg Visionman Prospector 1300 Specifications Hash Rate: 1.3TH/s 3 ASIC Mining blades 28nm Technology 1400 Watts Power 7A @ 200V or 14A @ 110V Air Cooled 55db Noise Embedded OS Visionman never Pre-Sells, these miners are in stock now, ready to ship from Hong Kong for just $3200 each. Add$200 shipping to your door. Just like our other mining systems, the Visionman Prospector 1300 is backed by a 1 Year parts and labor warranty and free lifetime toll-free tech support. Visionman Prospector 200 Still Available While inventory lasts, we still have a few of our 55nm Prospector 200 mining systems available at the low price of $400. These are a great system for learning about Bitcoin mining without making a big investment. They work just like our faster model, so they are ideal for getting started. Learn using Model 200 and step up to Model 1300 when you are ready to go big! http://gallery.mailchimp.com/f31d888...5c1d02fb98.jpg Visionman Prospector 200 Specs 200Gh/s (gigahash per second) Bitcoin Mining System 1000W Power Supply consumes 2.5W per Gigahash 110v (10A) or 220v (5A) Operation 55nm Avalon2 ASIC-based solution 160 ASICs on two carrier boards Stand Alone Operation, easy setup and management Raspberry Pi controller running special Linux kernal Dimensions: 17" x 6.25" x 17" Weight: 17kg/37.5lbs 1 Year Parts and Labor Warranty Lifetime Technical Support https://gallery.mailchimp.com/32de54...alon_board.jpg Visit our website to see more. Ordering is easy, just call us today at 1-800-690-6771 or click here to buy online. Visionman...Because Your Equipment Matters Now check out the price:$3,200.00 Next question: would something like this be worth writing specialized software for? Rodrigo
 2014-05-31, 03:09 #2 kracker     "Mr. Meeseeks" Jan 2012 California, USA 32×241 Posts If it would work at all. ASIC's are designed and made ONLY for mining whatever, they are useless(can't) for anything else.
 2014-05-31, 04:06 #3 Rodrigo     Jun 2010 Pennsylvania 2·467 Posts That's too bad. Does the inability have to do with the hardware itself? (Meaning, there would be no way to, umm, repurpose the machine.) Rodrigo
 2014-05-31, 05:46 #4 VBCurtis     "Curtis" Feb 2005 Riverside, CA 7·23·31 Posts Perhaps you would benefit from googling the acronym "ASIC"- Application Specific Integrated Circuit. Kracker meant what he said with the ONLY. Perhaps you mean to ask "how fast could we build an ASIC for Prime95?" That is a fair question, though cost prohibits it as anything beyond a what-if.
2014-05-31, 05:49   #5
LaurV
Romulan Interpreter

Jun 2011
Thailand

230548 Posts

Quote:
 Originally Posted by Rodrigo That's too bad. Does the inability have to do with the hardware itself? (Meaning, there would be no way to, umm, repurpose the machine.) Rodrigo
Exactly. It is hardware which is special designed to do SHA256 hashing. Like a hard-wired GPU. Thousands of small registers which can add and shift, and nothing else, and there is no way to make them doing something else without using hammer and pliers. Of course, this need an OS interface to put something in and extract the results, but that's all. Inside of the box, it can only do SHA hashing. When bitcoin is gone (if ever), you can use the machine as a rusty ornament for your garden. There may be possible to make an asic for TF (in fact is quite easy! no big memory requirement, hardware sieving (shift and set bit) etc. But convincing any asic in any way to make DP calculus (LL testing) is a HARD job even for the most advanced design houses in the world (I mean the guys who build asics for a living, like xilinx, altera, etc)

Last fiddled with by LaurV on 2014-05-31 at 05:50

 2014-05-31, 06:29 #6 Rodrigo     Jun 2010 Pennsylvania 11101001102 Posts Thanks for the scoop, VBCurtis and LaurV. Would it be fair to say that, because of the way this machine is designed, there isn't even any way to guesstimate how many GHz-days/day it would throughput -- if it could? (Sort of like asking, say, at how many MPH a thermostat could propel a hockey puck.) And (therefore) that such a question would be meaningless? These are the suggestions I take from the responses. Rodrigo
2014-05-31, 11:52   #7
Mini-Geek
Account Deleted

"Tim Sorbera"
Aug 2006
San Antonio, TX USA

22×11×97 Posts

I think the best comparison we can do is to look at Bitcoin mining speeds on GPUs and compare that to TF speeds on GPUs. The Radeon HD 7970 has benchmarks for both Bitcoin and TF, so I'll use that. It gets about 700 MHash/sec and about 400 GHz-days/day. So if we were to assume (probably wrong) that an ASIC for TF (as others have said, this would have to be different hardware from a SHA256 ASIC) could have the same difference, that ASIC would be (1300 GH/0.7 GH=) 1,857 times faster, or 742.8 THz-days/day. The whole of GIMPS currently is at ~77 THz-days/day (GPUto72 is around 15 THz of that). If we had one of those monsters going for us (guessing it's 50 times faster than our current TF abilities), we could probably TF to about 79 bits instead of 73/74, which would find around 7.5% more factors.

There are all sorts of reasons why this is probably wrong...I said best comparison, not good comparison. To actually know, we'd probably need some experts in ASIC design and TF algorithms to design and/or actually create some ASICs for us.

And you'd need a whole other ASIC for LL, where you'd probably not get nearly as much of a speed improvement. But, since it could be applied to the longer test, instead of the diminishing returns you get in TF, it could be more useful to GIMPS.

Quote:
 Originally Posted by Rodrigo Thanks for the scoop, VBCurtis and LaurV. Would it be fair to say that, because of the way this machine is designed, there isn't even any way to guesstimate how many GHz-days/day it would throughput -- if it could? (Sort of like asking, say, at how many MPH a thermostat could propel a hockey puck.) And (therefore) that such a question would be meaningless? These are the suggestions I take from the responses. Rodrigo
Yeah, I think you're right. But that doesn't mean we can't wildly speculate anyway!

Last fiddled with by Mini-Geek on 2014-05-31 at 12:03

 2014-05-31, 15:40 #8 retina Undefined     "The unspeakable one" Jun 2006 My evil lair 11000100001012 Posts Any comparison is useless. These things are not even remotely comparable. Don't even try. A SHA ASIC simply cannot ever be repurposed to do anything except SHA. Don't confuse this with an FPGA or a CPU or a GPU. It is none of these things and can't be made to emulate one either. Actually the thing that caught my attention was the 2-horse-power rating with only air cooling at 55dB. How is that possible?
2014-05-31, 16:01   #9
Rodrigo

Jun 2010
Pennsylvania

93410 Posts

That chart covers it pretty well, thanks! Amazing what sorts of things people put together for the 'Net.

Quote:
 Originally Posted by Mini-Geek But that doesn't mean we can't wildly speculate anyway!
That's what makes it fun!

Rodrigo

2014-05-31, 16:11   #10
Rodrigo

Jun 2010
Pennsylvania

2·467 Posts

Quote:
 Originally Posted by retina Any comparison is useless. These things are not even remotely comparable. Don't even try. A SHA ASIC simply cannot ever be repurposed to do anything except SHA. Don't confuse this with an FPGA or a CPU or a GPU. It is none of these things and can't be made to emulate one either. Actually the thing that caught my attention was the 2-horse-power rating with only air cooling at 55dB. How is that possible?
One does wonder. Always in order to heed the warning at the very top of the chart on the page that Mini-Geek linked to:

Quote:
 Note that products which have not shipped, especially by new vendors, may be scams! Be sure to research any of these intensely before giving them any money.
Maybe this vendor has been in operation for a while, but anyway it's not something I'd jump into without asking around first.

Another item that suggests "proceed with caution" is the disclaimer on the product page:

Quote:
 Due to the highly-specialized nature of these machines, they are non-cancellable and non-returnable.
Rodrigo

Last fiddled with by Rodrigo on 2014-05-31 at 16:17 Reason: clarification

 2014-05-31, 18:41 #11 ixfd64 Bemusing Prompter     "Danny" Dec 2002 California 2,411 Posts It would certainly be cool if there was an ASIC for trial factoring or Lucas-Lehmer tests. Unfortunately, I don't think we'll see any custom GIMPS hardware anytime soon because there is no monetary incentive for developing it. People don't earn money crunching for GIMPS as they would mining Bitcoins.

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