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Old 2020-06-20, 17:39   #12
xilman
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Uncwilly View Post
There are 2 related benefits that URL shorteners do provide:
1. Ease of transportability and entry. They can be printed out on the "take a tab" poster or other place. Before the QR code, they were the go to. Many years ago when Mapquest was what people turned to for directions, I was helping to organize a retreat off in the wilderness, where addresses were absent. So, I dropped a marker on the map and created a short URL that I could print of the flyer. 80+ random characters are far easier to get wrong.
2. Ease of remembrance. If one is riding or driving and sees the short url (especially if it uses a common service) it is far easier to remember when one can stop and check out the site. Or they can remember and share it (see point 1) with a friend/family/enemy that they think should visit the site.

LMGTFY is useful for humourous effects, or to show people how easy it is to find something, or to demonstrate a proper selection of search terms.

Thus, I would say that they have enough utility to not be prohibited, but discouraged from routine use.
They also have application in Twitter where text length is limited.
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Old 2020-06-20, 18:18   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Uncwilly View Post
LMGTFY is useful for humorous effects, or to show people how easy it is to find something, or to demonstrate a proper selection of search terms.

Thus, I would say that they have enough utility to not be prohibited, but discouraged from routine use.
Let Me Google That For You.

I have been a member since 2009 and I learned to stop asking questions because, most of the time, I would get a response consisting of links to other sites and pages. Many times, there would be no reply at all, meaning, no one wanted to mess with me, period.

In time, I learned to do my own research. If I could not find anything, then I would let it go and move on. I did not find anything humorous about it. My participation here now is virtually nil. I come here daily so see what is going on, but I treat these visits as read-only. I rarely write anything even if it is not in the form of a question. I simply do not want the grief.
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Old 2020-06-20, 18:39   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by storm5510 View Post
Let Me Google That For You.

I have been a member since 2009 and I learned to stop asking questions because, most of the time, I would get a response consisting of links to other sites and pages. Many times, there would be no reply at all, meaning, no one wanted to mess with me, period.
Not every question is worth an answer (see envocreti's blog). Posting links to a place that has a robust answer is useful. It is much better than, "It has been shown in book %$@@# that this is false.) Links are openly available, not all books are easily accessible. No one here has to answer any question. We do so because we want to. I have asked things before or made statements that got zero answers too. It happens.

The use of LMGTFY again should be limited. If Laurv asks something I might use that if it was a "no brainer", first link answer (that is for the humour). If it is a total newbie that asks something that would be found on the very first search of their question, I might use it.
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Old 2020-06-20, 22:43   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Uncwilly View Post
There are 2 related benefits that URL shorteners do provide:
1. Ease of transportability and entry. They can be printed out on the "take a tab" poster or other place. Before the QR code, they were the go to. Many years ago when Mapquest was what people turned to for directions, I was helping to organize a retreat off in the wilderness, where addresses were absent. So, I dropped a marker on the map and created a short URL that I could print of the flyer. 80+ random characters are far easier to get wrong.
2. Ease of remembrance. If one is riding or driving and sees the short url (especially if it uses a common service) it is far easier to remember when one can stop and check out the site. Or they can remember and share it (see point 1) with a friend/family/enemy that they think should visit the site.
This board doesn't have tear-tabs and we don't need to remember short URLs, we just click on them.
Quote:
Originally Posted by xilman View Post
They also have application in Twitter where text length is limited.
We don't have such a text limit on this board.

So URL shorteners don't provide any benefit here. I think we shouldn't use them so willingly.
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Old 2020-06-20, 22:55   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by retina View Post
This board doesn't have tear-tabs and we don't need to remember short URLs, we just click on them.We don't have such a text limit on this board.

So URL shorteners don't provide any benefit here. I think we shouldn't use them so willingly.
We don't live all of out on-line life on this board. So, at times there is the utility for sharing beyond the forum. And some of us do tweet and find a sing;e URL to share is handy.

Since you don't like them, don't post them. If you want to get to the target, there are services to check them out and lengthen them. Use them.

I stand by my original "not prohibited" but "cause to do so". It is a fair line to take.
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Old 2020-06-21, 13:37   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Uncwilly View Post
...The use of LMGTFY again should be limited. If Laurv asks something I might use that if it was a "no brainer", first link answer (that is for the humour). If it is a total newbie that asks something that would be found on the very first search of their question, I might use it.
What might be a "no-brainer" to some may not be for others. Most newbies go for the "Questions & Answers" section which is a good place to start. Some experienced users watch that topic and will reply to questions in some form. I have learned what I can get by with and what I cannot.
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Old 2020-06-21, 17:03   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by storm5510 View Post
I have been a member since 2009 and I learned to stop asking questions because, most of the time, I would get a response consisting of links to other sites and pages.
We differ. I welcome relevant links to authoritative documents. They not only answer my immediate question but there is a high chance that I will learn something else from them which I didn't previously know that I needed to know.
Quote:
Originally Posted by storm5510 View Post
Many times, there would be no reply at all, meaning, no one wanted to mess with me, period.
Have you considered the possibility that no-one knows the answer and is not willing to put in the research needed to find it?
Quote:
Originally Posted by storm5510 View Post
In time, I learned to do my own research. If I could not find anything, then I would let it go and move on. I did not find anything humorous about it. My participation here now is virtually nil. I come here daily so see what is going on, but I treat these visits as read-only. I rarely write anything even if it is not in the form of a question. I simply do not want the grief.
Doing your own research: good. IME it is a much better way of learning something than reading a canned narrow response to a narrowly phrased question.

I think it unfortunate that you experience grief but there are limits to how much of my time and efforts I will spend researching the answers to your questions and then typing up the results, all without any recompense other than a warm fuzzy feeling from having been helpful.

Last fiddled with by xilman on 2020-06-21 at 17:05
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Old 2020-06-21, 19:12   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xilman View Post
Have you considered the possibility that no-one knows the answer and is not willing to put in the research needed to find it?
Yes, that's one possibilty, but there's another: The topic is not seen as important by those who would be able to help. That starts with "I found the largest prime" (having 9 digits), but gets as far as special questions regarding GIMPS subprojects that are extremely specific but not hindering anyone else in getting there work done.
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Old 2020-06-21, 19:35   #20
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There's also the "no good deed goes unpunished" rule of thumb.
Any answer may be criticized somehow, as inaccurate, incomplete, off the mark, too verbose, etc.

Or the "eternal September" problem. People tire of answering the same questions from the stream of newcomers, after months and years.

Or some are waiting to see if someone else will answer. Or have tried to fill that need, and received criticism for posting too often.

Or those best able to answer are busy doing programming and testing their creations

Last fiddled with by kriesel on 2020-06-21 at 19:41
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Old 2020-06-21, 20:21   #21
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So (for me), in summary, if I'd get no answer at all, I'll think...
  • ...what I maybe could be doing better.
  • ...but primarily, I'd not be worrying at all.
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Old 2020-06-22, 00:26   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xilman View Post
We differ. I welcome relevant links to authoritative documents. They not only answer my immediate question but there is a high chance that I will learn something else from them which I didn't previously know that I needed to know.

Have you considered the possibility that no-one knows the answer and is not willing to put in the research needed to find it?
Doing your own research: good. IME it is a much better way of learning something than reading a canned narrow response to a narrowly phrased question.

I think it unfortunate that you experience grief but there are limits to how much of my time and efforts I will spend researching the answers to your questions and then typing up the results, all without any recompense other than a warm fuzzy feeling from having been helpful.
I always looked at the links provided. Sometimes, I could understand the contents and other times, not.

I found it difficult to believe that no one knowing anything relevant to what I was asking was possible here. Everything was always simple.

Over a short time, four members here became quite abrasive towards anything I wrote and it did not much matter what it was about. So, I stopped.

I will continue in my own way and do my own searching. I have no problems with this at all.
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