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Old 2017-08-27, 20:26   #1
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Originally Posted by retina View Post
Well some overzealous editor at WP doesn't mean much to me. WP also recommends using MiB and GiB, but in practice "no one" ever does. I am referring to normal English usage. IME normal English usage uses commas. Plus, exponents aren't "measures made with SI units", they're integers, they aren't measured, they aren't units, so there that problem with using a space (thin or otherwise).
Microsoft considers KiB, MiB, ... as errors. There have been law suits because of the way Microsoft uses units to indicate media capacity. I suppose you think that 1,024 is the same as 1 ? :-) Where does 1 stops ? at 2 or at 10 or at ...
K is thousand, M is a million, G is a thousand million or a billion. T is a trillion or a billion, not 1024, 1 048 576, 1 073 741 824 and 1 099 511 627 776.

SI is a system agreed upon internationally.

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Old 2017-08-27, 20:47   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by S485122 View Post
Microsoft considers KiB, MiB, ... as errors. There have been law suits because of the way Microsoft uses units to indicate media capacity. I suppose you think that 1,024 is the same as 1 ? :-) Where does 1 stops ? at 2 or at 10 or at ...
K is thousand, M is a million, G is a thousand million or a billion. T is a trillion or a billion, not 1024, 1 048 576, 1 073 741 824 and 1 099 511 627 776.
Context is the key here. If I use the acronym NSA you won't know what it is meant to stand for without the relevant context.
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Originally Posted by S485122 View Post
SI is a system agreed upon internationally.
Yes, by a small group wishing to proscribe, rather than describe. However if you walk into a shop and ask for some 16GiB RAM sticks the salesperson will probably wonder what you are talking about. You'll also lose your privilege of price negotiation for being a difficult customer.
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Old 2017-08-27, 22:16   #3
ATH
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Quote:
Originally Posted by S485122 View Post
SI is a system agreed upon internationally.
If you grew up with computers in the 80's or 90's (and earlier) you learned from the beginning that MB and GB was a multiple of 1024. Even though it was not the correct use of the prefixes Mega, Giga and so on, it is hard to switch away from what you have used for so many years. Specially when the new names kibibyte, mebibyte, gibibyte etc. sounds so silly.
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Old 2017-08-27, 22:46   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by retina View Post
Context is the key here. If I use the acronym NSA you won't know what it is meant to stand for without the relevant context.Yes, by a small group wishing to proscribe, rather than describe. However if you walk into a shop and ask for some 16GiB RAM sticks the salesperson will probably wonder what you are talking about. You'll also lose your privilege of price negotiation for being a difficult customer.
Are you sure it is only ISO ?
For instance IEC, IEEE, NIST, Ubuntu, MacOSX amongst others have also adopted that standard. Where do we use 1 kB = 1000 bytes, 1 MB = 1000 kB, 1 GB = 1000 MB, 1 TB = 1000 GB? And where do we use 1 KB = 1024 bytes, 1 MB = 1024 KB, 1 GB = 1024 MB, 1 TB = 1024 GB?

Jacob

Last fiddled with by S485122 on 2017-08-27 at 22:58 Reason: NIST should be enough for parochials
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Old 2017-08-28, 11:40   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ATH View Post
If you grew up with computers in the 80's or 90's (and earlier) you learned from the beginning that MB and GB was a multiple of 1024. Even though it was not the correct use of the prefixes Mega, Giga and so on, it is hard to switch away from what you have used for so many years. Specially when the new names kibibyte, mebibyte, gibibyte etc. sounds so silly.
They only sound silly because you haven't internalized them yet. They will eventually take hold; plenty of organizations and major software distributions use them (or at least their acronyms). I believe eventually the more-logically-consistent-if-historically-wrong kB = power of ten while kiB = power of two will become universal.
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Old 2017-08-28, 20:54   #6
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Originally Posted by Dubslow View Post
They only sound silly because you haven't internalized them yet. They will eventually take hold; plenty of organizations and major software distributions use them (or at least their acronyms). I believe eventually the more-logically-consistent-if-historically-wrong kB = power of ten while kiB = power of two will become universal.
Indeed. I find myself using them more and more. I'll still use the inaccurate i-less form when being lazy though.
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Old 2017-08-29, 01:42   #7
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Originally Posted by Mark Rose View Post
Indeed. I find myself using them more and more. I'll still use the inaccurate i-less form when being lazy though.
Out of curiosity, do you use them "more and more" in writing or orally? (I'm curious how they "sound" when spoken)
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Old 2017-08-29, 02:08   #8
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Originally Posted by preda View Post
Out of curiosity, do you use them "more and more" in writing or orally? (I'm curious how they "sound" when spoken)
Only written. I've not had a need to differentiate in speech so far. But basically the second syllable is replaced with 'bi' (which I pronounce bee).

kibibyte
mebibyte
gibibyte
tebibyte
pebibyte
exbibyte
zebibyte
yobibyte

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Binary_prefix
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Old 2017-08-29, 15:20   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ATH View Post
If you grew up with computers in the 80's or 90's (and earlier) you learned from the beginning that MB and GB was a multiple of 1024. Even though it was not the correct use of the prefixes Mega, Giga and so on, it is hard to switch away from what you have used for so many years. Specially when the new names kibibyte, mebibyte, gibibyte etc. sounds so silly.
Not to throw flame into the fire, but I'm still honestly puzzled about things like "kiloton". I understand the metric system, but WTH is that? 1000 tons, and what is a ton in the metric system? 1000 kilograms? So... a megagram?

Or in good old fashioned American measurements, a ton is 2000 pounds. So is a kiloton 2 million pounds? Or is is a fancy way of saying a metric ton (1000 kilograms) that's really ~2200 lbs? And why is it called a metric ton anyway... what's so wrong with something silly like a megagram, gigagram, etc? I thought that was the whole point of metric, to do away with archaic things like ton/tonne and ambiguity.

Sigh.

Fortunately I live in 'Murica where I can get charged by the honest to goodness ton (2000 lbs) when filling a dumpster or whatever.

(for the record, I mostly get what a kiloton is, by the "official" dictionary definition, but my point is, it's stupid and ambiguous and seems "metricky" but really should be taken out back and shot. I've had a bone to pick with "kiloton" for years)
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Old 2017-08-29, 15:50   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Madpoo View Post
Not to throw flame into the fire, but I'm still honestly puzzled about things like "kiloton". I understand the metric system, but WTH is that? 1000 tons, and what is a ton in the metric system? 1000 kilograms? So... a megagram?

Or in good old fashioned American measurements, a ton is 2000 pounds. So is a kiloton 2 million pounds? Or is is a fancy way of saying a metric ton (1000 kilograms) that's really ~2200 lbs? And why is it called a metric ton anyway... what's so wrong with something silly like a megagram, gigagram, etc? I thought that was the whole point of metric, to do away with archaic things like ton/tonne and ambiguity.

Sigh.

Fortunately I live in 'Murica where I can get charged by the honest to goodness ton (2000 lbs) when filling a dumpster or whatever.

(for the record, I mostly get what a kiloton is, by the "official" dictionary definition, but my point is, it's stupid and ambiguous and seems "metricky" but really should be taken out back and shot. I've had a bone to pick with "kiloton" for years)
Totally off topic. You also have the "long ton" which is 2240 pounds or 1,016.047 kilograms used in the UK and many of the Commonwealth nations. Although the UK has partially gone metric and the long ton was explicitly excluded from use for trade by the United Kingdom's Weights and Measures Act of 1985.
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Old 2017-08-29, 16:56   #11
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To me, the "kilo-" prefix implies metric. I have never heard or read "kilopound." Hence, I would read it as 1000 metric tons,
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