Engine-assisted game vs Stockfish, move 15 discussion

MooMoo2 · 2016-11-29, 06:33

The most popular move on the move 14 poll was ...O-O. Stockfish played 15. O-O, and the FEN is:
r2q1rk1/5pbp/p1npb3/1p1Npp2/4P3/2PB4/PPN2PPP/R2Q1RK1 b - - 6 15

Game so far: 1.e4 c5 2. Nf3 e6 3. d4 cxd4 4. Nxd4 Nf6 5. Nc3 Nc6 6. Ndb5 d6 7. Bf4 e5 8. Bg5 a6 9. Na3 b5 10. Bxf6 gxf6 11. Nd5 f5 12. c3 Bg7 13. Bd3 Be6 14. Nc2 O-O 15. O-O

Depth: 52 ply. Nodes searched: 3,170,038,679,293 (~3170 G)

Dubslow · 2016-11-29, 06:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by MooMoo2

Stockfish played 15. O-O

Interesting...

firejuggler · 2016-11-29, 07:23

fxe4 seem to be the move. Using the bishop to take the white knight would result in his immediate lose.

WMHalsdorf · 2016-11-29, 18:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by firejuggler

fxe4 seem to be the move. Using the bishop to take the white knight would result in his immediate lose.

15...fxe4 16.Bxe4 Rc8 would be the most likely moves played.
However 15...Bxd5 16.exd5 Ne7 is much more interesting.

gd_barnes · 2016-12-05, 22:17

I am now taking a close look at this position with help from Komodo. A quick 5 minute search to 25-ply has the following as its top 4 moves:

1. fxe4
2. Rc8
3. Bxd5
4. Kh8

I'll let it think deeper and push some pawns around as the day goes on and post more analysis later.

gd_barnes · 2016-12-06, 05:27

I had Komodo 10 look for ~4 hours and 34-ply at the top 3 moves. It definitely likes fxe4. This is the move that I had also liked after pushing a few pieces around and after looking at the opening DB, which has limited games at this point. Here is the analysis:

15...fxe4 16. Bxe4 Rc8 17. g3 f5 .00 (!)
15...Rc8 16. f3 Bxd5 17. exd5 Ne7 -.07
15...Kh8 16. a4 fxe4 17. Bxe4 bxa4 -.11

It did not care as much for 15...Bxd5. Nor did I. I don't like that fact that it gives up the good bishop for the knight (I really like the bishop pair) and although early in the game, we are left with opposite colored bishops, which is generally extremely drawish as the game progresses further.

With 15...fxe4, Komdo is saying that black has effectively equalized. Previous ply analysis for less than 34-ply had black at ~ -0.10. My thinking is that we are close to equalizing but not quite there yet...perhaps -.05. Therefore that is how I will vote. I could let it think deeper but I'm in a time crunch and won't have any more time to post on the forum before leaving town.

I only have a single machine using two cores that I have to dedicate to the analysis. It is my feeling that we are going to have to pool our resources to have a remote chance at victory at this point.

I will now be out of town for 10 days and will not have access to Komodo while I'm gone. It is my hope that others with strong programs will have the time and resources to take a look at subsequent positions.

2016-11-29, 06:33	#1
MooMoo2 "Michael Kwok" Aug 2010 709 Posts	Engine-assisted game vs Stockfish, move 15 discussion The most popular move on the move 14 poll was ...O-O. Stockfish played 15. O-O, and the FEN is: r2q1rk1/5pbp/p1npb3/1p1Npp2/4P3/2PB4/PPN2PPP/R2Q1RK1 b - - 6 15 Game so far: 1.e4 c5 2. Nf3 e6 3. d4 cxd4 4. Nxd4 Nf6 5. Nc3 Nc6 6. Ndb5 d6 7. Bf4 e5 8. Bg5 a6 9. Na3 b5 10. Bxf6 gxf6 11. Nd5 f5 12. c3 Bg7 13. Bd3 Be6 14. Nc2 O-O 15. O-O Depth: 52 ply. Nodes searched: 3,170,038,679,293 (~3170 G) Attached Thumbnails

2016-12-05, 22:17	#5
gd_barnes "Gary" May 2007 Overland Park, KS 2³·3²·167 Posts	I am now taking a close look at this position with help from Komodo. A quick 5 minute search to 25-ply has the following as its top 4 moves: 1. fxe4 2. Rc8 3. Bxd5 4. Kh8 I'll let it think deeper and push some pawns around as the day goes on and post more analysis later. Last fiddled with by gd_barnes on 2016-12-05 at 22:20

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2016-11-29, 07:23	#3
firejuggler "Vincent" Apr 2010 Over the rainbow 2²×7×103 Posts	fxe4 seem to be the move. Using the bishop to take the white knight would result in his immediate lose.

2016-12-06, 05:27	#6
gd_barnes "Gary" May 2007 Overland Park, KS 2³·3²·167 Posts	I had Komodo 10 look for ~4 hours and 34-ply at the top 3 moves. It definitely likes fxe4. This is the move that I had also liked after pushing a few pieces around and after looking at the opening DB, which has limited games at this point. Here is the analysis: 15...fxe4 16. Bxe4 Rc8 17. g3 f5 .00 (!) 15...Rc8 16. f3 Bxd5 17. exd5 Ne7 -.07 15...Kh8 16. a4 fxe4 17. Bxe4 bxa4 -.11 It did not care as much for 15...Bxd5. Nor did I. I don't like that fact that it gives up the good bishop for the knight (I really like the bishop pair) and although early in the game, we are left with opposite colored bishops, which is generally extremely drawish as the game progresses further. With 15...fxe4, Komdo is saying that black has effectively equalized. Previous ply analysis for less than 34-ply had black at ~ -0.10. My thinking is that we are close to equalizing but not quite there yet...perhaps -.05. Therefore that is how I will vote. I could let it think deeper but I'm in a time crunch and won't have any more time to post on the forum before leaving town. I only have a single machine using two cores that I have to dedicate to the analysis. It is my feeling that we are going to have to pool our resources to have a remote chance at victory at this point. I will now be out of town for 10 days and will not have access to Komodo while I'm gone. It is my hope that others with strong programs will have the time and resources to take a look at subsequent positions.