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2020-03-11, 15:29   #111
chalsall
If I May

"Chris Halsall"
Sep 2002

948010 Posts

Quote:
 Originally Posted by R.D. Silverman Yet you presume to make unjustified pronouncements. What compels you to do so?
To annoy you...

As I said, I /don't/ understand the maths. But my meta understanding, based on what has been written here by those who do understand the underlying ***theory***, is we've seen more MPs than expected. This might just be outliners. Or...

And, to put out there... Those who are theorists keep saying we should find about 1 factor every "bit level" TF'ed (e.g. 1/77 when going from 76 to 77). And yet, the empirical data suggests it's closer to 1/100.

Last fiddled with by chalsall on 2020-03-11 at 15:32 Reason: Clarification.

2020-03-11, 18:35   #112
kriesel

"TF79LL86GIMPS96gpu17"
Mar 2017
US midwest

2×2,459 Posts

Quote:
 Originally Posted by Uncwilly I did my own calc... took difference between successive values took the mean added the mean to the value calculated for 82589933 (M51) converted the resultant value back into the value for p.
Thanks for the clarification.
I suggest that ratio, not difference, would be the way to go.
And it's fairly moot, since all prediction methods for where is the next Mersenne prime are in practice no better than throwing darts blindfolded.

2020-03-11, 18:58   #113
kriesel

"TF79LL86GIMPS96gpu17"
Mar 2017
US midwest

10011001101102 Posts

Quote:
 Originally Posted by chalsall my meta understanding, based on what has been written here by those who do understand the underlying ***theory***, is we've seen more MPs than expected.
But not many more. And probability theory tells us that some deviation from the "expected" rate is likely. Fairly flip a coin 60 times. There's a chance you'll get 30 heads, 30 tails. There's a considerable chance you'll get something different.

Quote:
 Those who are theorists keep saying we should find about 1 factor every "bit level" TF'ed (e.g. 1/776 when going from 76 to 77). And yet, the empirical data suggests it's closer to 1/100.

Checking my own last 297 TF bit level results, over 72-76 bits, for an assumed average x=73.5 level,
1/x=0.136 x 297 = 4.04 factors expected. And I have 4 factors found. It's a small sample and could easily have been unlucky at 2 or lucky at 6 found. One of those found was in the first 25 results. These were produced mostly by new presumably reliable hardware. There are few error checks in TF. False factors will get detected at the server, but computation errors that lead to missing factors may go undetected.

Last fiddled with by kriesel on 2020-03-11 at 18:59

2020-03-11, 19:05   #114
chalsall
If I May

"Chris Halsall"
Sep 2002

23×3×5×79 Posts

Quote:
 Originally Posted by kriesel But not many more. And probability theory tells us that some deviation from the "expected" rate is likely.
I understand that. And I know that it is /most likely/ just a blip in the data.

But... We're getting more data every few years. And the theorists must always be willing to examine compelling empirical data. They have been known to occasionally be incorrect on some matters...

Last fiddled with by chalsall on 2020-03-11 at 19:09 Reason: Smelling mistake.

2020-03-13, 03:28   #115
dcheuk

Jan 2019
Pittsburgh, PA

11·23 Posts

Quote:
 Originally Posted by kriesel Why? Best heuristics say there are only about 6 left to find in p<109, which will take many decades to search completely. https://www.mersenneforum.org/showpo...5&postcount=11 https://www.mersenne.org/primes/ contains many waits of 5+ years, and some longer than a century.
Sorry I didn't mean to start an argument, stressful times.

Hopefully we will see a prime by this Christmas.

2020-03-13, 08:09   #116
LaurV
Romulan Interpreter

Jun 2011
Thailand

52×7×53 Posts

Quote:
 Originally Posted by dcheuk Hopefully we will see a prime by this Christmas.
Only if all travel bans are lifted. Otherwise, George may decide to stay home...

Last fiddled with by LaurV on 2020-03-13 at 08:09

2020-03-17, 03:11   #117
dcheuk

Jan 2019
Pittsburgh, PA

11·23 Posts

Quote:
 Originally Posted by LaurV Only if all travel bans are lifted. Otherwise, George may decide to stay home...
Lol

 2020-04-09, 17:22 #118 Uncwilly 6809 > 6502     """"""""""""""""""" Aug 2003 101×103 Posts 23·1,171 Posts I just noticed that is guess just got passed: Code: Uncwilly 12/29/2018 89999999 4/15/2020 The date guess is close to when the last value below that was finished. Oh, BTW, Ken has found a factor or completed a first time check on every guess in this thread. Last fiddled with by Uncwilly on 2020-04-09 at 17:28
2020-04-09, 18:10   #119
kriesel

"TF79LL86GIMPS96gpu17"
Mar 2017
US midwest

491810 Posts

Quote:
 Originally Posted by Uncwilly BTW, Ken has found a factor or completed a first time check on every guess in this thread.
The ongoing effort has covered a lot more than the scope of this thread's exponent guesses.

Another possible game is to make guesses as to when the remaining dubious claims or last M50 guess standing may fall. I won't participate, partly because I know the estimated schedules for some of these. See https://www.mersenneforum.org/showpo...04&postcount=5
To spice it up a bit, you could add the requirement for some of the larger ones that the guesser must still be alive to win, or allow that guesses can be passed on to an heir, perhaps only above a certain exponent size.
But don't wait too long, or there will be fewer to choose from.

Last fiddled with by kriesel on 2020-04-09 at 18:26

2020-07-24, 18:09   #120
Uncwilly
6809 > 6502

"""""""""""""""""""
Aug 2003
101×103 Posts

23·1,171 Posts

Quote:
 Originally Posted by Uncwilly I just noticed that is guess just got passed: Code: Uncwilly 12/29/2018 89999999 4/15/2020
Enough time has passed. I will now supplant that with 100002751 on October 6 2020

 2020-07-26, 06:08 #121 dannyridel   "AMD YES!" Jan 2020 Bellevue, WA 2×52 Posts My First Guess 111906173 on Jan.2nd, 2021.

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