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Old 2021-10-13, 14:04   #45
greenskull
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Yogurt is also kind of meat. Since it contains a large number of bacteria, live microorganisms. A bacteria is also a living creature made of flesh.
And beer is also meat. There are also myriads of bacteria.

By the way, Jains do not eat such fermented foods precisely to avoid killing microorganisms that are involved in the fermentation process.
They are forbidden to cook food at night. Since fire attracts moths and they may die.

I really like Jainism. I still have something to strive for.

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Old 2021-10-13, 14:08   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Uncwilly View Post
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/meat 1.b
he edible part of something as distinguished from its covering (such as a husk or shell)
2
animal tissue considered especially as food:

https://www.collinsdictionary.com/dictionary/english/meat 1
Meat is flesh taken from a dead animal that people cook and eat.
Not sure about the accuracy of the third.

I would classify salami, prosciutto, biltong and steak tartare as all containing predominantly meat. None of them are cooked in any conventional sense.
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Old 2021-10-13, 14:14   #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by greenskull View Post
Yogurt is also kind of meat. Since it contains a large number of bacteria, live microorganisms. A bacteria is also a living creature made of flesh.
And beer is also meat. There are also myriads of bacteria.

By the way, Jains do not eat such fermented foods precisely to avoid killing microorganisms that are involved in the fermentation process.
They are forbidden to cook food at night. Since fire attracts moths and they may die.

I really like Jainism. I still have something to strive for.
In that case, everything is meat. Bacteria and nematodes are ubiquitous.

A bacterium is not an animal according to the biological classification in use for the last century. Biologically, mushrooms are closer to animals than they are to bacteria, or to plants for that matter.
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Old 2021-10-13, 14:19   #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xilman View Post
In that case, everything is meat. Bacteria and nematodes are ubiquitous.

A bacterium is not an animal according to the biological classification in use for the last century. Biologically, mushrooms are closer to animals than they are to bacteria, or to plants for that matter.
Evolution of the angiosperm fruit implies that it will fall off the tree and be eaten.
The fruit is the logistics payment of the plant to those who are able to move and carry the seeds.
Therefore, fruits are not meat by definition.

But I already wrote about it here:
https://www.mersenneforum.org/showth...232#post590232

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A bacterium is not an animal according to the biological classification in use for the last century.
It is a pity that the Jains do not know anything about this. Talk to them :)

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Old 2021-10-13, 14:29   #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by greenskull View Post
Evolution of the angiosperm fruit implies that it will fall off the tree and be eaten.
The fruit is the logistics payment of the plant to those who are able to move and carry the seeds.
Therefore, fruits are not meat by definition.


It is a pity that the Jains do not know anything about this. Talk to them :)
But fruit will (almost certainly) contain nematodes ---- which are animals by definition ---- and so it is almost certain that by eating fruit you will also eat meat.

Read the wonderful statement by Nathan Cobb quoted in https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nematode

Bacteria are also present in essentially everything. If you consider bacteria meat ...

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Old 2021-10-13, 14:32   #50
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Originally Posted by greenskull View Post
Evolution of the angiosperm fruit implies that it will fall off the tree and be eaten.
Except for those which do not use that as a dispersal mechanism for their offspring.

Are you familiar with the existence of Sticky Willies, dandelions and coconuts?

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Old 2021-10-13, 14:42   #51
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A distinction should be made between gymnosperms and angiosperms.
The first evolutionary appeared earlier than the second. And they used and are using mainly wind, rivers and other natural elements to spread their genes.
The latter appeared later and got used to spreading their genes using animal forms that feed on the pulp of the fruit.

Quote:
Originally Posted by xilman View Post
But fruit will (almost certainly) contain nematodes ---- which are animals by definition ---- and so it is almost certain that by eating fruit you will also eat meat...
Then you have nothing to do but only to become a prana-eater.

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Old 2021-10-13, 14:51   #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by greenskull View Post
A distinction should be made between gymnosperms and angiosperms.
The first evolutionary appeared earlier than the second. And they used and are using mainly wind, rivers and other natural elements to spread their genes.
The latter appeared later and got used to spreading their genes using animal forms that feed on the pulp of the fruit.
The distinction should indeed be made. It is a distinction I was careful to take into account.

All the examples I gave are angiosperms.

Your turn.

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Old 2021-10-13, 14:52   #53
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Originally Posted by greenskull View Post
Then you have nothing to do but only to become a prana-eater.
Clearly false. You could give up trying to do the impossible and admit that you eat animal tissue.
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Old 2021-10-13, 15:03   #54
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Although dandelion belongs to the angiosperms, it does not form a fruit shell suitable for feeding for animal life forms. And to an important note, it has a slightly different mechanism for the spread of seeds.

Quote:
Originally Posted by xilman View Post
Clearly false. You could give up trying to do the impossible and admit that you eat animal tissue.
I am a pescetarian. I've already written about this a hundred times here.
You should at least pretend to read my comments. And less spamming here.

The correspondence with you makes me more and more bored :(

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Old 2021-10-13, 15:16   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xilman View Post
<snip>
Are you familiar with the existence of Sticky Willies, dandelions and coconuts?
"Sticky Willies?" That's a name I'm unfamiliar with.

[Google Google] Oh, Cleavers! Known to botanists as Galium aparine Yes, I'm familiar. Good name. Those things will even stick to bare skin. The seeds are little burs.

There is an unrelated plant, Western sticktight, Lappula occidentalis whose seeds are similar in character to those of Cleavers.

The most hideous of the plant hitchhikers I'm familiar with is goathead, AKA puncture vine, AKA caltrop, known to botanists as Tribulus terrestris. The seed capsules actually do look like goat heads, the "horns" being formidable spines. Those spines can puncture bicycle tires. I first became acquainted with this plant by stepping on one, and getting a painful jab from a spine that went straight through the sole of my right shoe.
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