The Right Way to Keep Bare Gubs - Page 30

only_human · 2016-06-17, 23:35

Freeze on gun research thaws a little as California opens center

kladner · 2016-06-18, 00:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by only_human

Family of AR-15 Inventor Eugene Stoner: He Didn't Intend It for Civilians

Quote:

"What has happened, good or bad, since his patents have expired is a result of our free market system," Stoner's family said. "Currently, a more interesting question is
'Who now is benefiting from the manufacturing and sales of AR-15s, and for what uses?'"
That's the question for the rest of us.

A modern answer to counter the Kalashnikov. Just what ya need when some dude looks at yer wife (or You!) "funny" in a crowded bar.
How many hundred shell casings have been picked up in Pulse? How much killing time would that guy have lost if he had had to reload every twelve rounds?
[URL="https://www.facebook.com/wftv/posts/10153976003968145"]202[/URL]

ewmayer · 2016-06-22, 00:52

Well, lookee here:

Before Omar Mateen Committed Mass Murder, The FBI Tried To ‘Lure’ Him Into A Terror Plot | Smirking Chimp

Because it's a heck of a lot easier to stop terror plots of your own manufacturing than it is to detect and stop the real ones, obviously.

only_human · 2016-06-23, 02:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by ewmayer

Well, lookee here:

Before Omar Mateen Committed Mass Murder, The FBI Tried To ‘Lure’ Him Into A Terror Plot | Smirking Chimp

Because it's a heck of a lot easier to stop terror plots of your own manufacturing than it is to detect and stop the real ones, obviously.

Well this is odd. I've been fairly consistently uncomfortable with the FBI manufactured plots to entice people into acts that get the Fibbies blue ribbons for catching homegrown terrorists of the FBI's own provocation; but -- in this case they could have ensnared someone who did end up being an actual agent of destruction. I may be more tolerant of the FBI's machinations in the future even though I'm not sure that I'm comfortable with choosing possible and unknowable benefits in this way that sacrifices ideals for practicalities and big brother botheration.

ewmayer · 2016-06-23, 03:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by only_human

Well this is odd. I've been fairly consistently uncomfortable with the FBI manufactured plots to entice people into acts that get the Fibbies blue ribbons for catching homegrown terrorists of the FBI's own provocation; but -- in this case they could have ensnared someone who did end up being an actual agent of destruction. I may be more tolerant of the FBI's machinations in the future even though I'm not sure that I'm comfortable with choosing possible and unknowable benefits in this way that sacrifices ideals for practicalities and big brother botheration.

Not following your logic ... you had reservations based on FBI's track record of terror-plot entrapment-scammery, but this time they actually had a legitimate person of interest in their sights for a long time and did nothing to prevent him from committing mass murder, so your faith is restored? What am I missing?

only_human · 2016-06-23, 03:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by ewmayer

Not following your logic ... you had reservations based on FBI's track record of terror-plot entrapment-scammery, but this time they actually had a legitimate person of interest in their sights for a long time and did nothing to prevent him from committing mass murder, so your faith is restored? What am I missing?

I have no faith here to restore. My staring into the abyss is that I am less resistant to the FBI trying their dubious actions if occasionally bad rabbits end up in the cross-hairs. The fact that they blew it is a different matter.

only_human · 2016-06-23, 22:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by only_human

I have no faith here to restore. My staring into the abyss is that I am less resistant to the FBI trying their dubious actions if occasionally bad rabbits end up in the cross-hairs. The fact that they blew it is a different matter.

For example, today someone was charged with trying to blow up Bureau of Land Management property. "He was caught because the person he assigned to build the remote-detonated bomb was an undercover FBI agent." Feds: Utah Militia Man Tried to Bomb BLM

S485122 · 2016-06-24, 06:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by only_human

For example, today someone was charged with trying to blow up Bureau of Land Management property. "He was caught because the person he assigned to build the remote-detonated bomb was an undercover FBI agent." Feds: Utah Militia Man Tried to Bomb BLM

This is something that I can't understand : members of "law enforcing" agencies inducing people to break the law in order to be able to catch them. I am sure they push some over the threshold that would never have crossed it, if not for the help offered by those agencies.

In Europe that kind of tactics is prohibited by law even if there is a push from law enforcement to be able to usethem. Sometimes they try it and more often than not it is a fiasco where the people involved "forgot" the purpose of what they were doing.

Jacob

only_human · 2016-06-24, 07:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by S485122

This is something that I can't understand : members of "law enforcing" agencies inducing people to break the law in order to be able to catch them. I am sure they push some over the threshold that would never have crossed it, if not for the help offered by those agencies.

In Europe that kind of tactics is prohibited by law even if there is a push from law enforcement to be able to usethem. Sometimes they try it and more often than not it is a fiasco where the people involved "forgot" the purpose of what they were doing.

Jacob

There is no question that it is wrong. But then after a while one starts to think: well, they are doing it anyway and maybe it's not so bad. That is why I quoted Nietzsche about staring into the abyss. https://www.quora.com/What-did-Nietz...es-back-at-you

Frustration and appeasement.

ewmayer · 2016-06-24, 08:45

o Democratic revolt over gun laws brings House to a halt | McClatchy

NC's Lambert Strether comments: "Billed in the press as a “sit-in.” Oh? Where are the cops in flak jackets? The tear-gas? The armored personnel vehicles? The LRADs? Wake me when some pols are kettled. This spectacle from the same party that orchestrated a 17-city paramilitary crackdown of Occupy! It pains me to agree with Paul Ryan, but when he calls this a “stunt,” he’s right. I think the Democrat Establishment has lost its mind."

And reader "RabidGandhi" adds: "The Team Blue sit in reminded me of HRC’s sundry attacks on Sanders voting record: first mischaracterise the legislation, then blow dogwhistles. After this stunt, they will now be able to accuse their future opponents of having “voted to give guns to terrorists”– of course ignoring the fact that the bill had nothing to do with terrorists, and everything to do with further expanding the Bush era policy of secret blacklists of people (mostly muslim) whose constitutional rights can be denied.

Then of course you have to be daft not to ask: how come they can stage a sit down for muslim bashing but not for jailing hedgie fraudsters, torturers, closing Guantánamo….

It’s the party of pathetic."

o The Democrats Are Boldly Fighting For a Bad, Stupid Bill | Gawker

While in the Senate, the Red Team pursues its own bad, stupid bill:

o Senate votes down proposal to expand FBI surveillance powers | Reuters

Could come up for another vote within days - and even if it fails again, no worries, they'll find a way to get it passed soon enough, even if it takes another FBI-sponsored 'homegrown terror plot' to tip the voting balance over the needed threshold. Maybe have a radicalized islamist attack a Christian group ... yeah, that could work, no gay stigma attendant to that, and maximizes the 'religious terror' angle.

kladner · 2016-06-27, 03:44

.

2016-06-27, 03:44	#330
kladner "Kieren" Jul 2011 In My Own Galaxy! 2·3·1,693 Posts	. Attached Thumbnails

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2016-06-17, 23:35	#320
only_human "Gang aft agley" Sep 2002 3754₁₀ Posts	Freeze on gun research thaws a little as California opens center

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ewmayer ∂²ω=0 Sep 2002 República de California 19·613 Posts	Well, lookee here: Before Omar Mateen Committed Mass Murder, The FBI Tried To ‘Lure’ Him Into A Terror Plot \| Smirking Chimp Because it's a heck of a lot easier to stop terror plots of your own manufacturing than it is to detect and stop the real ones, obviously.

2016-06-24, 08:45	#329
ewmayer ∂²ω=0 Sep 2002 República de California 19×613 Posts	o Democratic revolt over gun laws brings House to a halt \| McClatchy NC's Lambert Strether comments: "Billed in the press as a “sit-in.” Oh? Where are the cops in flak jackets? The tear-gas? The armored personnel vehicles? The LRADs? Wake me when some pols are kettled. This spectacle from the same party that orchestrated a 17-city paramilitary crackdown of Occupy! It pains me to agree with Paul Ryan, but when he calls this a “stunt,” he’s right. I think the Democrat Establishment has lost its mind." And reader "RabidGandhi" adds: "The Team Blue sit in reminded me of HRC’s sundry attacks on Sanders voting record: first mischaracterise the legislation, then blow dogwhistles. After this stunt, they will now be able to accuse their future opponents of having “voted to give guns to terrorists”– of course ignoring the fact that the bill had nothing to do with terrorists, and everything to do with further expanding the Bush era policy of secret blacklists of people (mostly muslim) whose constitutional rights can be denied. Then of course you have to be daft not to ask: how come they can stage a sit down for muslim bashing but not for jailing hedgie fraudsters, torturers, closing Guantánamo…. It’s the party of pathetic." o The Democrats Are Boldly Fighting For a Bad, Stupid Bill \| Gawker While in the Senate, the Red Team pursues its own bad, stupid bill: o Senate votes down proposal to expand FBI surveillance powers \| Reuters Could come up for another vote within days - and even if it fails again, no worries, they'll find a way to get it passed soon enough, even if it takes another FBI-sponsored 'homegrown terror plot' to tip the voting balance over the needed threshold. Maybe have a radicalized islamist attack a Christian group ... yeah, that could work, no gay stigma attendant to that, and maximizes the 'religious terror' angle.