Move 32

Brian-E · 2013-06-11, 19:04

They have of course kept their heads and protected f4 leaving us completely paralysed and helpless.

We could resign. It's not a bad moment for that, because their super-solid 31...Be5 shows that they know they can just tie all the ends up, take away any hope of counter-play that we have, and then just walk into our position.

However, we could also play on and hope for a line like 32.Bb7 Bd3 33.Bc6 Bf1+ 34.Kh1 Bh3 35.Bxb5 Ree1 36.Bxc4+ Kh8 37.Qxa7 Rxg1+ 38.Qxg1 Rxg1+ 39.Kxg1 when we have our queenside pawns and they need to be a touch careful to stop our a pawn in time. But: this ending is clearly won for them, and anyway they can obviously improve on the line I have given and don't need to throw their queenside pawns away at all.

So should we resign now? Or play on a bit? What does everyone think?

richs · 2013-06-14, 02:55

I've been thinking about your comments, Brian, and we are in deep trouble, that's for sure. But I still think there's a small chance for a draw so I would like to continue playing. I suggest Nf3 as our next move. I think they will follow with either Bd3 or Bg4. We still have play after either of those moves.

I say let's keep flogging this "almost" dead horse!

Brian-E · 2013-06-14, 08:58

32.Nf3 would be fine by me. I think every legal move is as good as any other now.

henryzz · 2013-06-14, 12:14

Nf3 looks as reasonable as anything else. It looks a dire situation. I would prefer to avoid resigning before it is an obvious mate. It is very annoying if someone resigns just as you are winning.

Brian-E · 2013-06-14, 19:34

Shall we play 32.Nf3 then?

About resigning: I agree with you David that it is impolite to resign when the position is not completely hopeless. I also think, though, that it is impolite [I]not[/I] to resign if the opponent's win is absolutely trivial but will still take many moves. But that is not the case yet.

chalsall · 2013-06-14, 19:40

[QUOTE=Brian-E;343428]But that is not the case yet.[/QUOTE]

Gentlemen...

I would encourage you to play this game to the end.

Few could have played as strongly as you have.

Regards.

Brian-E · 2013-06-14, 20:34

[QUOTE=chalsall;343429]Gentlemen...

I would encourage you to play this game to the end.

Few could have played as strongly as you have.

Regards.[/QUOTE]
I just want to make sure people don't misunderstand what I mean:

In the position below, Black, whether on move or not, obviously cannot stop the pawn. It will queen, and White will mate with king and queen against king. The mate will take approximately 8 or 9 moves. This sort of position must be resigned. Playing it on, especially in a correspondence game, is very bad etiquette. That's what I mean by a position which it is impolite not to resign. Similarly, a position with a ridiculous material disadvantage such as a rook down must be resigned too.

Batalov · 2013-06-14, 21:16

In super-blitz, if white has 0.8 second left and black has 8, white can end up dropping the flag and this will be adjudicated as a draw (yes, draw). And it won't be impolite for black to keep going and fight for that draw. Black may have sacrificed a lot of material to keep their 8 seconds to get to this draw [and not drop the flag first], so theoretically it may make sense.

But we are not playing blitz here, so I am just saying.

Brian-E · 2013-06-14, 21:22

[QUOTE=Batalov;343440]In super-blitz, if white has 0.8 second left and black has 8, white can end up dropping the flag and this will be adjudicated as a draw (yes, draw). And it won't be impolite for black to keep going and fight for that draw. Black may have sacrificed a lot of material to keep their 8 seconds to get to this draw [and not drop the flag first], so theoretically it may make sense.

But we are not playing blitz here, so I am just saying.[/QUOTE]
Yep.:smile:
You won't catch me playing bullet. Any resemblance to chess is purely coincidental.

2013-06-11, 19:04	#1
Brian-E "Brian" Jul 2007 The Netherlands 2×11×149 Posts	Move 32 They have of course kept their heads and protected f4 leaving us completely paralysed and helpless. We could resign. It's not a bad moment for that, because their super-solid 31...Be5 shows that they know they can just tie all the ends up, take away any hope of counter-play that we have, and then just walk into our position. However, we could also play on and hope for a line like 32.Bb7 Bd3 33.Bc6 Bf1+ 34.Kh1 Bh3 35.Bxb5 Ree1 36.Bxc4+ Kh8 37.Qxa7 Rxg1+ 38.Qxg1 Rxg1+ 39.Kxg1 when we have our queenside pawns and they need to be a touch careful to stop our a pawn in time. But: this ending is clearly won for them, and anyway they can obviously improve on the line I have given and don't need to throw their queenside pawns away at all. So should we resign now? Or play on a bit? What does everyone think? Last fiddled with by Brian-E on 2013-06-11 at 19:10

2013-06-14, 02:55	#2
richs "Rich" Aug 2002 Benicia, California 1718₁₀ Posts	I've been thinking about your comments, Brian, and we are in deep trouble, that's for sure. But I still think there's a small chance for a draw so I would like to continue playing. I suggest Nf3 as our next move. I think they will follow with either Bd3 or Bg4. We still have play after either of those moves. I say let's keep flogging this "almost" dead horse! Last fiddled with by richs on 2013-06-14 at 02:55 Reason: corrected spelling

2013-06-14, 20:34	#7
Brian-E "Brian" Jul 2007 The Netherlands CCE₁₆ Posts	[QUOTE=chalsall;343429]Gentlemen... I would encourage you to play this game to the end. Few could have played as strongly as you have. Regards.[/QUOTE] I just want to make sure people don't misunderstand what I mean: In the position below, Black, whether on move or not, obviously cannot stop the pawn. It will queen, and White will mate with king and queen against king. The mate will take approximately 8 or 9 moves. This sort of position must be resigned. Playing it on, especially in a correspondence game, is very bad etiquette. That's what I mean by a position which it is impolite not to resign. Similarly, a position with a ridiculous material disadvantage such as a rook down must be resigned too. Attached Thumbnails

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2013-06-14, 08:58	#3
Brian-E "Brian" Jul 2007 The Netherlands 2×11×149 Posts	32.Nf3 would be fine by me. I think every legal move is as good as any other now.

2013-06-14, 12:14	#4
henryzz Just call me Henry "David" Sep 2007 Liverpool (GMT/BST) 3·23·89 Posts	Nf3 looks as reasonable as anything else. It looks a dire situation. I would prefer to avoid resigning before it is an obvious mate. It is very annoying if someone resigns just as you are winning.

2013-06-14, 19:34	#5
Brian-E "Brian" Jul 2007 The Netherlands 3278₁₀ Posts	Shall we play 32.Nf3 then? About resigning: I agree with you David that it is impolite to resign when the position is not completely hopeless. I also think, though, that it is impolite [I]not[/I] to resign if the opponent's win is absolutely trivial but will still take many moves. But that is not the case yet.

2013-06-14, 19:40	#6
chalsall If I May "Chris Halsall" Sep 2002 Barbados 2×11²×47 Posts	[QUOTE=Brian-E;343428]But that is not the case yet.[/QUOTE] Gentlemen... I would encourage you to play this game to the end. Few could have played as strongly as you have. Regards.

2013-06-14, 21:16	#8
Batalov "Serge" Mar 2008 San Diego, Calif. 3²×7×163 Posts	In super-blitz, if white has 0.8 second left and black has 8, white can end up dropping the flag and this will be adjudicated as a draw (yes, draw). And it won't be impolite for black to keep going and fight for that draw. Black may have sacrificed a lot of material to keep their 8 seconds to get to this draw [and not drop the flag first], so theoretically it may make sense. But we are not playing blitz here, so I am just saying.

2013-06-14, 21:22	#9
Brian-E "Brian" Jul 2007 The Netherlands 3278₁₀ Posts	[QUOTE=Batalov;343440]In super-blitz, if white has 0.8 second left and black has 8, white can end up dropping the flag and this will be adjudicated as a draw (yes, draw). And it won't be impolite for black to keep going and fight for that draw. Black may have sacrificed a lot of material to keep their 8 seconds to get to this draw [and not drop the flag first], so theoretically it may make sense. But we are not playing blitz here, so I am just saying.[/QUOTE] Yep.:smile: You won't catch me playing bullet. Any resemblance to chess is purely coincidental.