Keeping the Heat down at Home - Page 4

QuintLeo · 2002-10-08, 20:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Albaby348

How did you people learn about setting up a home farm?

Trial and error from my early Distributed.net days.

Once you've set up your first couple dedicated Crackers, though, the ones after that get pretty easy.

QuintLeo · 2002-10-08, 21:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by outlnder

I just built 15 machines and put them on a steel rack I purchased from KMart.

They all have NICs connected to hubs and the hubs are connected to a router which is connected to the Internet via cable modem.

I have an extra monitor, keyboard and mouse that I plug into each machine if something goes wrong or I need to change something.

A few things you need to remember about home farming.

1) There is an awful lot of noise. With a minimum of 2 fans per case, it gets loud.
2) Expensive, not only to build, but the monthly electric bill. Mine is over $120 each month.
3) You need extension cords from all over the house to round out the power supply. You can't put 15 machines on 2 or 3 wall sockets. You'll blow a fuse or circuit breaker. You need to spread it out over multiple fuses or breakers.
4) Upkeep. You have to babysit your machines until you are sure they can run unattended. If you build one a month, then each one would have a month's running you can watch. Operating systems are not the most stable things in the world. Some crash for no reason. Some installs don't work well, you may need to reformat and reinstall.
5) Don't use crappy parts. Even if they are free or cheap. They will always come back to haunt you. Get decent stuff that will last and won't cause computer failure.
6) Try to get identical parts. This will help if and when hard drives fail. If all the drivers are the same, then hard drive swaps are easy.
7) Power supplies must be sufficient for the hardware. Don't skimp on PSUs. Without enough power, your machines are door stops.
8) You only need one floppy and CDROM drive. Plug them in when you install, then remove when not needed anymore. Make sure you make the appropriate BIOS entries.
9) If you go with cases, leave the sides off for better cooling. Yes, this makes them louder, but the added cooling is what stops errors, especially in Prime95.

Any questions, just ask. We would love to help.

My K5 farm, and a couple of my K6 boxes (12 machines, 2 KVMs, 2 KB/Monitors) sits in a steel rack - I forget where I got the rack, I've got a bunch of them I've used for storage for years.

The rest of my hodgepodge farm just parks all over the computer room, mostly on a couple tables or in my 19" rack (all the Dualy boxes and the Gateway/Router/Firewall Linux box are rack mounted).

*Most* of my dedicated cruncher boxes run on a 10Base-2 (coax) net segment - I've got TONS of BNC "T" and 2'/3'/6' BNC-BNC jumper cables left over from my days as an active Electronic Tech / Ham - and found a batch of 3c509s at $10 for 10 from a local surplus outlet, along with several others I've picked up cheap from Hamfests over the years.

My electric bill the last couple months has been around $140. Not a problem in the cold - the money I spend on electric SAVES on my winter heating bill - not good in the summer. I do *not* use air conditioning in the computer room - can't AFFORD it any more.

On the plus side - the "computer room" was designed to be the master bedroom - the breaker panel is in there, and I've got *5* outlets, all on seperate breakers. No extension cords needed - though I do have to use 6-into-2 outlet adapters on 3 of the outlets, and a power strip on another. I just make sure to not overload any of the individual circuits.
The electrical wiring predated my buying the place - and is the reason I made that room my "computer room".

OSs - I find that if LINUX works for 2-3 days on particular hardware, it'll KEEP running 'till some of the hardware dies or the power goes out. I don't run "crappy OSs" on my dedicated crackers, and try to avoid Win OSs in general when possible. 8-)

Leaving the case off is sometimes a BAD thing - depends on the case design and the cooling fan(s) in the case. In my case, *ROOM* airflow considerations require me to have the air flow front-to-back in all my cases, so that I can direct the hot air out the window. That window has 3 "dual-fan" type window fans pushing air out, and I have fresh air coming in from the crawlspace, sucked in through a 20x20 furnace filter by a room-type box fan.

I've not had to turn the furnace on yet this fall, despite nighttime temps in the 40s and one night in the low 30s - I just close the window, shut down the window fans, block the air intake with a piece of rigid foam insulation sized for an airtight fit, and turn on a fan I have hanging from the ceiling to blow hot air out of that room down the hall into the rest of the place.

Also - though a manufacturer would have to violate FCC regs to do so - I *remove* any blockage at the PS fan, for better airflow - and tend to make small mods to the bottom of the case front panel to open up more airflow as well. More cooling is a Good Thing on 24/7 machines....

outlnder · 2002-10-09, 02:39

I don't have any fans in or on my cases, that's why I leave them open.

A case fan would add, I believe, an unnecessary increase in electricity usage.

QuintLeo · 2002-10-10, 20:28

A case fan (for most common 80mm and 92mm case fans) uses less than 3 watts of power - typically 12VDC at less than .2 Amps, often more like .15 Amps (less than 2 watts).

If we're looking at Athlon or P-IV systems, this is almost definitely less than 5% of the total system power, and more likely under 2%.

Definitely worth it, if you're serious about keeping your system cool and stable - and can often, if set up correctly, help keep your system components (especially CPU and HD) from dying for a LOT longer period.

outlnder · 2002-10-11, 08:14

I am currently running 15 machines, from Durons to Tbirds to XPs and a P4. I have been doing this for 3 years. As of this date, I have never lost a CPU to burn out or any component besides hard drives and PSUs.

At one time I was running 20 systems evenly divided AMD and Intel. All of them have been running without case fans and sides.

If you add up all the $100+ months of power bills for all these systems, you will see that even 2% is too much money to waste.

Yes, there is a lot of noise from a sideless case. But compare that to 15 to 20 extra fans.

Each person runs his or her farm in whatever manner they see fit. For me, cheap is best. I can put up with the noise and the heat. I can't spend money that I don't have on extra costs, such as case fans and the electricity.

If that is how you outfit yours, great, more power to you. But 3 years from now, tell me how much more money you have spent on electricity that you could have spent on upgrades or new machines.

QuintLeo · 2002-10-11, 16:33

I've had a few hard drives die on me - but I tend to buy old cheap ones, as they're plenty for a dedicated cruncher.

Usually, the death is the result of a fan in the system dying and the HD then getting NO air circulation.

I do *not* have air conditioning in my computer room - it's *cheaper* for me to run extra fans to keep system components cool than to try to pay for the air conditioning to keep the WHOLE ROOM cool - and when I wouldn't need the air conditioning, I'm saving on winter *heating* bills. There's parhaps a 3-4 week period, on average per year, spread out over various days in the spring and in the fall when that doesn't apply.

Your situation may differ. Lotsa variables for ALL of us.

BTW - noise is NOT a factor I consider. i *LIKE* Delta FFB series fans - and I'm ex-Navy, so the noise factor in my computer room is LOWER than the average noise level on the Ranger (Aircraft Carrier I served on) in the UHF Radio equipment space that was my primary duty station. Tubes take a LOT of fans to keep cool....

Paulie · 2002-10-15, 19:06

My G4 Powerbook was running a bit warm, so I picked up a little fan to blow additional air into the intake vent as well as the bottom of the laptop:

http://www.kensington.com/images/62648M.jpg

http://www.kensington.com/html/1265.html

:)

Tasuke · 2002-10-15, 19:37

annother thing to concider, is using cheep old laptop hdd's. I am looking at how mucha an ide adapter costs, but I just got a couple and they are quiet, cool, and use little power. I am gonna try to get my hands on a bunch of 1 and 2 giggers ane see how much of a difference it makes.

/edit Found one http://www.cablesnmor.com/hard-drive-converter.html

outlnder · 2002-10-16, 06:19

I checked this out a couple of years ago. Found out that the drive and converter are about double the cost of a regular 3.5" IDE hard drive.

If you can get the drives for free, then it might be worth it.

Xyzzy · 2002-10-16, 06:48

Just thought I'd share these prices with you all...

Toshiba MK4006MAV, 4 GB, Ultra ATA/33, 4200 RPM, 13.6 ms seek, 128 KB cache, 2.5" portable, 3-year warranty. $45.00

Quantum Ultra ATA/66 EIDE, 4.3 GB, 5400 RPM, 9.5 ms seek, 3.5" LP, 40 pin interface, 3-year warranty. $39.00

Free shipping if you mention "www.storagereview.com"...

www.hypermicro.com

Tasuke · 2002-10-16, 21:04

Converters cost me a total of $12 in parts and maybe 1/2 hour labor, and I am getting drives free out of old pentium laptops. For a 80-90% power reduction it is well worth it.

And I don't do Quantum.

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2002-10-09, 02:39	#36
outlnder Aug 2002 2·3·53 Posts	I don't have any fans in or on my cases, that's why I leave them open. A case fan would add, I believe, an unnecessary increase in electricity usage.

2002-10-10, 20:28	#37
QuintLeo Oct 2002 Lost in the hills of Iowa 2⁶×7 Posts	A case fan (for most common 80mm and 92mm case fans) uses less than 3 watts of power - typically 12VDC at less than .2 Amps, often more like .15 Amps (less than 2 watts). If we're looking at Athlon or P-IV systems, this is almost definitely less than 5% of the total system power, and more likely under 2%. Definitely worth it, if you're serious about keeping your system cool and stable - and can often, if set up correctly, help keep your system components (especially CPU and HD) from dying for a LOT longer period.

2002-10-11, 08:14	#38
outlnder Aug 2002 13E₁₆ Posts	I am currently running 15 machines, from Durons to Tbirds to XPs and a P4. I have been doing this for 3 years. As of this date, I have never lost a CPU to burn out or any component besides hard drives and PSUs. At one time I was running 20 systems evenly divided AMD and Intel. All of them have been running without case fans and sides. If you add up all the $100+ months of power bills for all these systems, you will see that even 2% is too much money to waste. Yes, there is a lot of noise from a sideless case. But compare that to 15 to 20 extra fans. Each person runs his or her farm in whatever manner they see fit. For me, cheap is best. I can put up with the noise and the heat. I can't spend money that I don't have on extra costs, such as case fans and the electricity. If that is how you outfit yours, great, more power to you. But 3 years from now, tell me how much more money you have spent on electricity that you could have spent on upgrades or new machines.

2002-10-11, 16:33	#39
QuintLeo Oct 2002 Lost in the hills of Iowa 448₁₀ Posts	I've had a few hard drives die on me - but I tend to buy old cheap ones, as they're plenty for a dedicated cruncher. Usually, the death is the result of a fan in the system dying and the HD then getting NO air circulation. I do not have air conditioning in my computer room - it's cheaper for me to run extra fans to keep system components cool than to try to pay for the air conditioning to keep the WHOLE ROOM cool - and when I wouldn't need the air conditioning, I'm saving on winter heating bills. There's parhaps a 3-4 week period, on average per year, spread out over various days in the spring and in the fall when that doesn't apply. Your situation may differ. Lotsa variables for ALL of us. BTW - noise is NOT a factor I consider. i LIKE Delta FFB series fans - and I'm ex-Navy, so the noise factor in my computer room is LOWER than the average noise level on the Ranger (Aircraft Carrier I served on) in the UHF Radio equipment space that was my primary duty station. Tubes take a LOT of fans to keep cool....

2002-10-15, 19:06	#40
Paulie Aug 2002 223 Posts	My G4 Powerbook was running a bit warm, so I picked up a little fan to blow additional air into the intake vent as well as the bottom of the laptop: http://www.kensington.com/images/62648M.jpg http://www.kensington.com/html/1265.html :)

2002-10-15, 19:37	#41
Tasuke Aug 2002 48₁₆ Posts	annother thing to concider, is using cheep old laptop hdd's. I am looking at how mucha an ide adapter costs, but I just got a couple and they are quiet, cool, and use little power. I am gonna try to get my hands on a bunch of 1 and 2 giggers ane see how much of a difference it makes. /edit Found one http://www.cablesnmor.com/hard-drive-converter.html

2002-10-16, 06:19	#42
outlnder Aug 2002 2×3×53 Posts	I checked this out a couple of years ago. Found out that the drive and converter are about double the cost of a regular 3.5" IDE hard drive. If you can get the drives for free, then it might be worth it.

2002-10-16, 06:48	#43
Xyzzy Aug 2002 2·3²·13·37 Posts	Just thought I'd share these prices with you all... Toshiba MK4006MAV, 4 GB, Ultra ATA/33, 4200 RPM, 13.6 ms seek, 128 KB cache, 2.5" portable, 3-year warranty. $45.00 Quantum Ultra ATA/66 EIDE, 4.3 GB, 5400 RPM, 9.5 ms seek, 3.5" LP, 40 pin interface, 3-year warranty. $39.00 Free shipping if you mention "www.storagereview.com"... www.hypermicro.com

2002-10-16, 21:04	#44
Tasuke Aug 2002 72₁₀ Posts	Converters cost me a total of $12 in parts and maybe 1/2 hour labor, and I am getting drives free out of old pentium laptops. For a 80-90% power reduction it is well worth it. And I don't do Quantum.