To be fair, the major 3rd party candidates this time around aren't stellar either. Gary Johnson appears to be unaware of anything that happens outside of the US, and Jill Stein has been busy throwing nods to anti-vaxxers and thinks that Wi-fi is damaging children's brains.

3rd parties would do better if they started local and built up, in my opinion.

[QUOTE=rogue;444623]As far as I am concerned, both parties brought this on themselves. Both parties had more electable candidates, but the party machines didn't care.[/QUOTE]Well, if you live in a country which chooses its leaders on the basis of a popularity contest ...

[QUOTE=davar55;444611]
Trump's past is in the process of being flouted to try to take him down.
The responses to his tax and sex issues are out of proportion.[/QUOTE]
Why should he skate on taxes? Are those just for "the little people," to quote [URL="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leona_Helmsley"]Leona Helmsley.[/URL]

As to the other, we are talking about someone who brags about sexual assault. There is no "out of proportion" there.

Too many people have been distracted by the crude language: "graphic", "lewd", etc. It's not about talking dirty. It's about Trump sexually assaulting less powerful people because he thinks he's entitled. That kind of sociopath has no place running the country.

I hope that Trump has successfully alienated enough people that he has no chance of winning.

Wether the plague or cholera win, USA will get the president they deserve, not the one they need.

[QUOTE=firejuggler;444648]Wether the plague or cholera win, USA will get the president they deserve, not the one they need.[/QUOTE]

There's a song in there, somewhere...

So is Bill Clinton a better person because he didn't assault the numerous women he slept with (although some have accused him of rape)? I understand the election isn't about him, but Hillary did verbally assault the women that Bill slept with. I can't see how her behavior towards women has been much better.

Note that I am in no way condoning Trump's words or actions. Both men are slime balls. I think Hillary is a terrible person for painting her husband as a victim despite the evidence. I wonder she would be viewed today if she divorced him over it. I am as appalled by the women who blindly support her (because she is a woman) as I am by those who support Trump despite all of the inflammatory words that comes from his mouth.

I said nothing about the "Big Dawg." I have many grievances with his tenure. But I was only addressing this revelation in the current campaign. Bill ain't personally running, though he will be awfully close to those Levers of Power.

I have plenty of problems with Secretary Clinton, not least because of things she supported when she actually had the powers of that title.

But you propose a false equivalence. Whatever his many failings, Bill never gave such signs of outright batsh!tiness as The Donald has provided us with.

I realize that you were not comparing them on that scale (batsh!tiness). On the ethical comparison of their respective sexual exploits and attitudes toward women, I really don't know anything but public knowledge, and in Bill's case, I was so utterly, simultaneously, enraged, disgusted, and bored sh!!less by the Congressional antics, and his, that I have not dug deeply into those sorts of details.

There are much more current issues to consider. Perhaps if we had heard similar tape of Bill when he was running, it might have tripped him up. However, Trump is running now, and we can do something about him

I agree, both are slime.

EDIT: However, Bill and Hillary do seem to keep their foundation a bit less crooked than Trump's piggy bank.

[QUOTE=kladner;444643]As to the other, we are talking about someone who brags about sexual assault. [/QUOTE]
Well... every one wishes what he doesn't have, and wants to do what he can not do...
In my country there is an antique popular wisdom about the people with longer fingers (or noses, or feet) having longer dicks. So, for a guy with small fingers, it is not shocking that he wish to assault someone sexually... :razz:

It is not possible to defend H.Clinton, she is beyond acceptability.
So I'll try to defend Trump instead. We do need to choose.

taxes: he pays taxes as an employer. like any smart citizen he
tries to minimize his personal income tax. the issue of a billionaire
paying very little income tax in certain years is a non-starter, when
his audits are complete we'll find out whether and how much he
has actually paid.

sex: past public crudeness long before his decision to become president
must be seen in the light of privacy versus politics. his attitude toward
women has obviously been improving, especially since he got called on it
at the first primary debate.

[QUOTE]his attitude toward women has obviously been improving, especially since he got called on it
at the first primary debate. [/QUOTE]
His minders have managed to somewhat train him to sound better. I don't think he is capable of giving up his deep-seated narcissism. He came back from sounding reasonably statesman-like in Mexico, only to have a Tweet send him back to Lala Land.

I consider Clinton dangerous, but for other reasons. Trump's danger to us is lack of impulse control. Clinton's danger to us is in calculated foreign policy decisions. She has calmly decided to take a brinkswoman's path, which leads to greater world tension and discord.

So Trump might destroy the world in the heat of a moment. Clinton might take a course which leads her to coldly deciding to do things which could lead to the world being destroyed. ("World here means the human world as we know it.)

[QUOTE=kladner;444713]Trump's danger to us is lack of impulse control. Clinton's danger to us is in calculated foreign policy decisions.[/QUOTE]

+1.