[QUOTE=xilman;379960]Please justify that statement.

It is far from clear to me that one can't keep silent in such a situation.[/QUOTE]

I suppose it should have been "mustn't" keep silent, since of
course one "can". I was referring to the "marketplace of ideas"
when we're free or the "public curb" when we're not. It's
imperative for the better ideas to be propounded, or the
negatives will win out.

[QUOTE=chappy;379279][YOUTUBE]5joYY3VrBtM[/YOUTUBE]

Let's put the whole thing to the test![/QUOTE]
This video is, at the very least, disingenuous(possibly unintentionally) and, at worst, a straight up intentional lie.

Assuming you've already watched the video, let's consider alternate universes. In one universe, every cut or scrape means a long drawn out death from infection. In the other universe, dramaticly fast healing(compared to this universe) is simply the way things are.

Both universes would have people that (1) Considered God an awesome and benevolent being, and (2) people that either consider God to be evil or nonexistent.

If God continued to give us a perfect world after we'd sinned, what's the point of repentance. It's not about whether God is good or evil, it's about our own choice as to which way to go in our lives.

As my Grandma loved to say, "Oh, Lordy, Lordy, Lordy." This usually seemed to be an indication that she felt she had suffered some grievous slight, and was laying heavy guilt rays on her targets.

In this case it means, "Here we go again..."

[QUOTE=kladner;380111]As my Grandma loved to say, "Oh, Lordy, Lordy, Lordy." This usually seemed to be an indication that she felt she had suffered some grievous slight, and was laying heavy guilt rays on her targets.

In this case it means, "Here we go again..."[/QUOTE]

Nah. That kind of illogical "analysis" can't be maintained for long.

[QUOTE=jasong;380106]This video is, at the very least, [STRIKE]disingenuous[/STRIKE] [COLOR="Red"]humorous[/COLOR] (possibly unintentionally) and, at worst, a straight up [STRIKE]intentional lie[/STRIKE] [COLOR="Red"]humorous video[/COLOR].[/QUOTE]

Fixed some spelling errors for you.

[QUOTE=jasong;380106]Assuming you've already watched the video, let's consider alternate universes. In one universe, every cut or scrape means a long drawn out death from infection. In the other universe, dramaticly fast healing(compared to this universe) is simply the way things are.[/QUOTE]

These are not opposites. But, I'll allow it. I want to see where this is going.


[QUOTE=jasong;380106]Both universes would have people that (1) Considered God an awesome and benevolent being, and (2) people that either consider God to be evil or nonexistent.[/QUOTE]

Again you are using non-polar pairs. I've given you a lot of leeway councilor, please get to your point.

[QUOTE=jasong;380106]
If God continued to give us a perfect world after we'd sinned, what's the point of repentance. It's not about whether God is good or evil, it's about our own choice as to which way to go in our lives.[/QUOTE]

Now I'm confused. Your argument seems to be missing a few steps. And what was the point of the earlier digressions involving healing mechanisms and the vast range of potential belief systems whittled down to just two potential groups?

1) You make an assumption that God at one time gave us a perfect world. There is no evidence for this outside of one of the many competing ancient belief systems.

2) You make an assumption that sinning is a concept that we agree is meaningful.

3) You make the wrong argument that a person who is given a perfect world can't still be repentant of the sin. This is the crux of why your argument, which is common to Christians everywhere, is so nonsensical. A person who makes the right choices in the absence of punishment is at least as moral as someone who makes the right choices because of punishment. Most people, myself included, would argue that they are more moral. The God punishes us because we sin motif robs us of the ability to achieve the higher moral status of doing good merely because it is good and not because there might be fear of punishment. (see my post in another area in this forum about how some Christians need to stop feeding on 3rd grade Sunday school morality tales and grow up.)

4) It is [B]ALL[/B] about whether God is good or evil. If she is good then she's terrible at engineering. And terrible at psychology. And terrible at a host of other endeavors.
And if she is evil, then she isn't worth my time or effort to worship.

So we KNOW She's not good.
That settles it for me.

[QUOTE=davar55;380123]So we KNOW She's not good.
That settles it for me.[/QUOTE]

I mean, if a She God is not good, there's no hope for a he God.

So we spend a lot of time pedantically in this thread, talking about things like the bible and stuff, but what evidence do we have that we are qualified to talk about these things?

I mean, some of us read these books years ago. Others never even read them. So perhaps one of those silly Facebook type quizzes will be able to shine some light upon our understanding of the biblical texts that we often discuss:

[url]http://exchristian.net/3/[/url]

is a simple 20 question test with all the textual references that hits many of the major points of the gospel narrative. Maybe we should verify that we know the subject before we discuss it any further.

[QUOTE][url]http://exchristian.net/3/[/url]

is a simple 20 question test with all the textual references that hits many of the major points of the gospel narrative. Maybe we should verify that we know the subject before we discuss it any further.[/QUOTE]Nice!

:ttu:

Priceless! [SPOILER]Hint: Take the quiz at least twice![/SPOILER]

Took the quiz. Ignored the pattern of choices that developed.

[spoiler]
Got literally a perfect score - zero! Ranked as clueless.

Even though I personally think even an atheist should be somewhat
familiar with the details of some religion or other, I can't say I'm not
proud to have gotten all 20 questions. Wrong. And honestly I was
not trying to get them all wrong.

(I am guessing from the above ^^ that whatever I answered for each
question would have been wrong, by a different reference. I just
can't do this twice. If so, clever site.)
[/spoiler]