[QUOTE=davar55;368941]I addressed my discussion in this
thread (all of it, not just that post) to the atheist who knows
there is no "God" but can't prove it, or to the agnostics who
think no such proof of non-existence of "God" can ever be made.[/QUOTE]

I, personally, am in the latter group.

Please present your proof.

If you can't, then it's all just an individual, personal, "leap of faith".

I personally am in neither group. I'm an Atheist who knows that you can't know whether there is a supreme being or not but doesn't feel like the question means much. I also cannot "know" that Russell's teapot exists, or that it doesn't exist. Yet neither it's existence or non-existence seems to have any impact on my life.

If there is a deity she knows where to find me, and exactly what it would take for me to believe in her existence. Until such time as a supreme being is willing to take that minimum effort, I will continue to live as if she doesn't exist.

So, I too would like to see your "proof" that seems to require that I already agree with the conclusion to accept the premises (cart before the horse.)

:godposting: (intentional error in the smiley spelling)
Excellent post chappy. I personally subscribe 101% to this thinking.

[QUOTE=chappy;368987]
So, I too would like to see your "proof" that seems to require that I already agree with the conclusion to accept the premises (cart before the horse.)[/QUOTE]

:smile:

Not exactly, but it sure helps.

[QUOTE=davar55;369037]Not exactly, but it sure helps.[/QUOTE]

And the claimed proof is still outstanding....

I can prove the non-existence of god, and it is very easy. I just choose not to for ... reasons. [/davar55]

Why so coy?

[QUOTE=chalsall;369038]And the claimed proof is still outstanding....[/QUOTE]

Thank you! :smile:

[QUOTE=retina;369068]I can prove the non-existence of god, and it is very easy. I just choose not to for ... reasons. [/davar55]
Why so coy?[/QUOTE]

It's best presented only to the choir. :smile:

[QUOTE=chappy;368987]...
I'm an Atheist who knows that you can't know whether there is a supreme being or not but doesn't feel like the question means much.
...[/QUOTE]

Perhaps if you said you "think" you can't know you'd be in one of the
two categories? How can you "know" that it's impossible for anyone
else to know with certainty that there's no supreme being (which gives
us a start on a common definition of "God" which in my view leads to
a contradiction)?

A proof isn't a proof until it's shared. My proof is ultimately a challenge
proof, challenging any definition, evidence, or supposed proof of
existence. Since there are only a finite number of people, and no one
has a non-contradictory definition of a supreme being, and no one has
provided any genuine evidence of existence of a supreme being, and
every proof of existence has been disproved (you did a job on the
ontological proof and the intelligent design proof earlier in this thread),
that enormous accumulation of facts in contradiction to the existence
of "God" should be persuasive enough for any atheist to consider the
matter settled and proved. Agnostics leaning towards "God" might
choose to argue on.

You're talking about a "supreme being", but that begs a couple of questions about what God is.

My definition of God is "Ultimate Purpose". Is that contradictory? Is it reasonable to say that because no-one has demonstrated Ultimate Purpose, then this cannot exist?

[QUOTE=retina;369068]I can prove the non-existence of god, and it is very easy. I just choose not to for ... reasons. [/davar55]

Why so coy?[/QUOTE]
I can prove the non-existence of god and it is very easy. I just choose not to, because i am afraid of God...


P.S. is god case sensitive?

[QUOTE=LaurV;369097]P.S. is god case sensitive?[/QUOTE]Perhaps you can ask him.