[QUOTE=vsuite;434740]Or just that all the LLTF is already assigned to GPU to 72 and awaiting completion?
[/QUOTE]

That is the case.
Also, related to manual assignments (and the rest of your first post), do you have something against Misfit, too? You can run Misfit and configure it to get the assignments for you, either from GIMPS or GPU72. There is no drawback joining GPU72. You still can get the exponents you want, by setting Misfit convenient, and when you finish with them, Misfit will report the results for you, [U]to PrimeNet directly[/U]. Then GPU72 will see they are done, and delete them from its assignment list. You still get all your credit at GIMPS/PrimeNet, and you get additional credit at GPU72.

But if you don't want that, you still can get (low) assignments directly from PrimeNet, with Misfit, although the chances to get them so low as 7xM are small because GPU72 will grab them.

In either case, Misfit will do [U]all the manual work[/U] for you. Bye bye manual work, writing scripts, etc...

[QUOTE=vsuite;434741]How is that graph applied IRL please?

<snip>[/QUOTE]

You got it right. The main goal of the project is to find primes, and texnically* you can find them faster if you can eliminate faster the exponents which will not give a prime. So, [U]you have to tune your system for every range you want to participate.[/U] Every system is different. I get much better results towards LL with my water-cooled cards than with the air-cooled, even if everything else is the same, for example. That is because LL uses the memory of the card a lot, when TF does not.

If you can eliminate more than one exponent by doing TF at a particular bitlevel and size of the exponent, that is, if you can find [U]new factors[/U] for more than one exponent, faster then your same hardware would do two LL tests, then you do TF. Otherwise you better do LL.

Same for DC, but only one test, that is why the DC line is lower with one bit, as the TF required time doubles with every bit.

--------
* this is not exactly true, there are many discussions, which generally agree that we will find prime faster if for example will not do any DC, etc. But that is behind the point, as the goal of GIMPS is not only to find primes, but also clearing the ranges behind, factoring small mersennes, etc. By "the goal of gimps" I mean the common goal of all participants, and not the officially declared goal. People do whatever type of job they think it better suits their particular goals and vanities.

[QUOTE=vsuite;434740]I use Manual Assignments to get TF candidates for my GPUs [around 1000GHz-day/day total] and they are all at least 128M, way ahead of the 75M-80M LL wavefront.

Does this mean that all the TF necessary around the LL wavefront is completed? Or just that all the LLTF is already assigned to GPU to 72 and awaiting completion?

Let's say I want to do more TF between 75M and 100M how can I get those candidates assigned without joining GPU to 72?[/QUOTE]

GPU72 is holding on to everything below 82M that isn't trial factored to what GPU72 considers high enough. You should be able to get exponents higher than that.

Also keep in mind that PrimeNet has a much lower threshold for TF being completed, as it's considering the case of CPUs. PrimeNet considers an 85M exponent to be fully factored at 71 bits. In fact, every exponent up about 125M or so is already TF'ed to 71 bits. If you want something between 82M and 100M, set the pledge level to 72 or 73 and you should get exponents.

[QUOTE=Mark Rose;434764]GPU72 is holding on to everything below 82M that isn't trial factored to what GPU72 considers high enough. You should be able to get exponents higher than that.[/QUOTE]

Further to this, GPU72 is currently managing on average 50,000 GHz Days per Day of GPU TF compute.

We carefully balance our resources to ensure all the "wave fronts" are appropriately "fed", including the very hungry P-1'ers.

In the past people have accused us of "hoarding" TF assignments. This is not the intention; instead we hold onto candidates until appropriately TF'ed so no candidates are assigned sub-appropriately worked.

If you don't want to work through GPU72, that's fine. There should be a way for you to get candidates to TF with your GPU through Primenet in the 82M range.

Thanks everyone.

On average is it still 1 in bit level factors found at the 82M level and the 128M level? eg 1 in 75 exponents tested at 75 bits will give a factor?

[QUOTE=LaurV;434743]That is the case.
Also, related to manual assignments (and the rest of your first post), do you have something against Misfit, too? You can run Misfit and configure it to get the assignments for you, either from GIMPS or GPU72. There is no drawback joining GPU72. You still can get the exponents you want, by setting Misfit convenient, and when you finish with them, Misfit will report the results for you, [U]to PrimeNet directly[/U]. Then GPU72 will see they are done, and delete them from its assignment list. You still get all your credit at GIMPS/PrimeNet, and you get additional credit at GPU72.

But if you don't want that, you still can get (low) assignments directly from PrimeNet, with Misfit, although the chances to get them so low as 7xM are small because GPU72 will grab them.

In either case, Misfit will do [U]all the manual work[/U] for you. Bye bye manual work, writing scripts, etc...[/QUOTE]
Sounds good.

This Factoring Effort Report page can give a list of exponents not carried to 75 bits for example, but I assume even if I added these to mfaktc, there could be a risk someone else legitimately gets them using MISFIT especially if I take a couple of days to return the results.

[URL]http://www.mersenne.org/report_factoring_effort/?exp_lo=82000000&exp_hi=82050000&bits_lo=1&bits_hi=99&txt=1&exassigned=1&tfonly=1&worktodo=1&tftobits=75[/URL]

I don't have something against MISFIT per se. I've just downloaded it. Just not set it up yet.

[QUOTE=Mark Rose;434764]{snip...}Also keep in mind that PrimeNet has a much lower threshold for TF being completed, as it's considering the case of CPUs. PrimeNet considers an 85M exponent to be fully factored at 71 bits. In fact, every exponent up about 125M or so is already TF'ed to 71 bits. If you want something between 82M and 100M, set the pledge level to 72 or 73 and you should get exponents.[/QUOTE]
I guess this means 'pledge level' using MISFIT.

I assume it is not possible to get manual assignments from Primenet above 82M to carry to 75 bits since PrimeNet considers them all completed at 71 bits.

[QUOTE=vsuite;434857] eg 1 in 75 exponents tested at 75 bits will give a factor?[/QUOTE]
Yes. Please mind that this calculus is "coarse", i.e. it ignores some things, as explained in the [URL="http://www.mersenne.org/various/math.php#lucas-lehmer"]gimps math page[/URL], see the "chance to find a factor" at the end of "LL test" subsection. For our purpose, "chance of finding a factor between 2[SUP]X[/SUP] and 2[SUP]X+1[/SUP] is about 1/x". Now, that is (much) better if there was no P-1 done in the range (up to almost double, as you go higher with the exponents) and it is much worse (down to half of it) if there was lots of P-1 done for the range. You can look to Chris' [URL="http://www.gpu72.com/reports/factor_percentage/"]tables[/URL] to see that odds, keeping in mind that the DC range had a lot of P-1 (therefore, there was about 1 factor found for every 100 "bitruns" or so, at bitlevel 73 or so,), and the first-LL had not much of it (therefore as good as 1 factor was found for every 60 or even 50 runs, at the same bitlevels).

I too have been wondering if there was a way for non-GPU-to-72 people to get exponents in the 80-90M range, and haven't run across one yet. (I am using Misfit to fetch directly from GIMPS, and getting work in the 130M range - which is fine, but it'll be a good long while before any benefit from that factoring is seen.)

I am not necessarily averse to joining GPU to 72, either, though I havent as yet done anything more than wade through some of the documentation.

I DO sort of wish that the Primenet assignment list wasn't "messed up" by all the just-in-time trial factoring... maybe that will take care of itself in some few months, if GPU to 72 gets ahead of the wavefront, so that most of the LL range will not show as checked out for factoring anymore?

[QUOTE=Siegmund;434887]I am not necessarily averse to joining GPU to 72, either, though I havent as yet done anything more than wade through some of the documentation.[/QUOTE]

It really isn't that difficult, especially when using MISFIT. After the initial account creation (which is only needed in order to keep track of assignments and to give credit appropriately) it's pretty much "fire-and-forget". And, just to be clear, while GPU72 "owns" the candidates, all credit for work goes to the workers.

[QUOTE=Siegmund;434887]I DO sort of wish that the Primenet assignment list wasn't "messed up" by all the just-in-time trial factoring... maybe that will take care of itself in some few months, if GPU to 72 gets ahead of the wavefront, so that most of the LL range will not show as checked out for factoring anymore?[/QUOTE]

This is needed in order to ensure no candidates are assigned for LL'ing without being appropriately TF'ed and P-1'ed. And rather than "messed-up", consider the TF column on Primenet as reading "Not yet appropriately TF'ed".

Anything in the "To be LL assigned" (second to right-most) column has already been appropriately TF'ed and P-1'ed, and anything in the "To be P-1 assigned" (third from right-most) column has already been appropriately TF'ed, but not yet P-1'ed.

In about three months or so we should have pulled ahead of all four LL'ing wave-fronts, and the P-1'ers. At that time I plan to pass control back to Primenet, with GPU72 acting as a proxy so the "pretty graphs" and stats will continue for those interested.

[QUOTE=Siegmund;434887]I too have been wondering if there was a way for non-GPU-to-72 people to get exponents in the 80-90M range, and haven't run across one yet. (I am using Misfit to fetch directly from GIMPS, and getting work in the 130M range - which is fine, but it'll be a good long while before any benefit from that factoring is seen.)

I am not necessarily averse to joining GPU to 72, either, though I havent as yet done anything more than wade through some of the documentation.

I DO sort of wish that the Primenet assignment list wasn't "messed up" by all the just-in-time trial factoring... maybe that will take care of itself in some few months, if GPU to 72 gets ahead of the wavefront, so that most of the LL range will not show as checked out for factoring anymore?[/QUOTE]

I just tried [url]http://mersenne.org/manual_gpu_assignment[/url] and entered:

TF for first-time LL
80000000 to 85000000
Lowest exponents
75 (bit level)

and got an assignment just above 82000000

Aha. So one could download a block of those manually, and paste them in to MISFITworktodo.txt. I think I will do that, next time my supply of exponents is low. (Of course I just got 50 more in the M130s just this morning.) Thanks for pointing out how that works.

@Siegmund: what is your pledge level in Misfit? If you go to 75, there is no reason why you shouldn't get ~83M work to do. :surprised: