[QUOTE=xilman;494669]The version I was taught has [I]i before e except after c [b]when the sound is ee[/b][/I].[/QUOTE]

The version I was taught is [I]i before e except after c and when sounding like A as in neighbor or weigh,[/I]

[QUOTE=rogue;494576][URL="https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2017/06/28/the-i-before-e-except-after-c-rule-is-a-giant-lie/?utm_term=.71cdb5bd8107"]The ‘i before e, except after c’ rule is a giant lie[/URL]

Of course most of us already knew that. If I drank coffee, [URL="https://www.amazon.com/MyCozyCups-Before-Weird-Mug-Literature/dp/B079ZYZVBM"]this[/URL] would be a nice cup to have.[/QUOTE][QUOTE=xilman;494669]The version I was taught has [I]i before e except after c [b]when the sound is ee[/b][/I].

[I]Sheila: seize weird Keith[/I] is a grammatically correct sentence formed entirely from exceptions.[/QUOTE][QUOTE=wblipp;494774]The version I was taught is [I]i before e except after c and when sounding like A as in neighbor or weigh,[/I][/QUOTE]I don't understand the problem. Just learn each spelling as a separate entity. No need for "rules", especially when they are not rules at all. Rulz r 4 weard peepull that knot no how 2 spel.

[QUOTE=retina;494778]... Rulz r 4 weard peepull that knot no how 2 spel.[/QUOTE]
Brings to mind the story of [U]Ladle Rat Rotten Hut[/U]:

Wants pawn term, dare worse disk ladle gull, hoe lift honor itch offer lodge dock florist...

[QUOTE=EdH;494800]Brings to mind the story of [U]Ladle Rat Rotten Hut[/U]:

Wants pawn term, dare worse disk ladle gull, hoe lift honor itch offer lodge dock florist...[/QUOTE]Ouch, that hurts my brain. I want more.

[QUOTE=EdH;494800]Brings to mind the story of [U]Ladle Rat Rotten Hut[/U]:

Wants pawn term, dare worse disk ladle gull, hoe lift honor itch offer lodge dock florist...[/QUOTE]

I can still figure most of this out sadly. [B]Little red riding hood[/B]

Once upon time, their was this little girl, who lived on her itch offer large dark forest...

[QUOTE=science_man_88;494811]I can still figure most of this out sadly. [B]Little red riding hood[/B]

Once upon time, their was this little girl, who lived on her itch offer large dark forest...[/QUOTE]Try harder, almost there.

[QUOTE=retina;494810]Ouch, that hurts my brain. I want more.[/QUOTE]
I was a little off in my rendition. Here's a good one:


[URL="http://www.exploratorium.edu/files/exhibits/ladle/"]Ladle Rat Rotten Hut[/URL]

[QUOTE=EdH;494814]I was a little off in my rendition. Here's a good one:


[URL="http://www.exploratorium.edu/files/exhibits/ladle/"]Ladle Rat Rotten Hut[/URL][/QUOTE]:tu:

[QUOTE=EdH;494814]I was a little off in my rendition. Here's a good one:


[URL="http://www.exploratorium.edu/files/exhibits/ladle/"]Ladle Rat Rotten Hut[/URL][/QUOTE]

Irvine Welsh wrote the whole book pretty much like that --

[QUOTE]I dinnae Tam, ah jist dinnae. Life's boring and futile. We start oaf wi high hopes, then we bottle it. We realize that we're aw gaunnae die, withoot really findin oot the big answers. We develop aw they long-winded ideas which jist interpret the reality ay oor lives in different weys, withoot really extending oor body ay worthwhile knowledge, about the big things, the real things. Basically, we live a short, disappointing life; and then we die. We fill oor lives up wi shite, shite like joabs n relationships, tae delude ourselves intae thinkin that it isnae aw totally pointless. Smack's an honest drug, because it strips away these delusions. It's the only really honest drug. It disnae alter yir consciousness. It jist gies ye a hit and a sense ay well-being. After that, ye see the misery ay the world as it is, and ye cannae anesthaetise yirsel against it.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Batalov;494821]Irvine Welsh wrote the whole book pretty much like that --[/QUOTE]

My favorite part of [i]Trainspotting[/i] was the scene in which Sick Boy is air-rifle-sniping at goers in the nearby park, and channeling his inner Sean-Connery-as-James-Bond while doing so. Favorite, because in the film version Sick Boy is played by Jonny Lee Miller, master of 1000 accents and real-life grandson of Bernard Lee, who played M in the Bond series until his death.

[I]Feersum Ennjin[/I] anyone?

I am quite chuffed and nonplussed to read this egregious webpage ereyesterday:

[url]https://www.buzzfeed.com/katangus/english-is-ridiculous[/url]

BTW: I never said she stole my money

haha, you are right...

[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A8zWWp0akUU[/URL]

(fun part: it makes the same sense for me as it would be pronounced "normally", and it is exactly as I, a "Latin-based" speaker, would read it, if I would get an English text in my hand for the first time without having any previous knowledge of English)

The History of English podcast might interest you then.

[QUOTE=Uncwilly;495340]The History of English podcast might interest you then.[/QUOTE]

I'll add that to my list.

Some of my other favorites are Lore, Myths and Legends, Cabinet of Curiosities, and Unexplained.

[INDENT][INDENT] Dearest creature in creation,
Study English pronunciation.
I will teach you in my verse
Sounds like corpse, corps, horse, and worse.
I will keep you, Suzy, busy,
Make your head with heat grow dizzy.
Tear in eye, your dress will tear.
So shall I! Oh hear my prayer.
Pray, console your loving poet,
Make my coat look new, dear, sew it!
[/INDENT][/INDENT]and so on.

There are a few variants on [I]The Chaos[/I] out there. My favourite rhymes chicory with Terpsichore and trickery. Another has a line which begins "Reading Reading" where the capitalization is essential to understand its meaning.

I, an educated native English speaker with a more than adequate vocabulary, have never been able to read [I]The Chaos[/I] out loud without making at least three errors or hesitations.

[QUOTE=rogue;495344]I'll add that to my list.[/QUOTE]This is one that you should start from episode 1 and not listen to the current episodes until you catch up.

My ear bandwidth is fairly full at the moment (I have about 100 series on my player, ~75 are dead, completed, or nearly so.) I just recently finished Wolf 359 (I heard about in not too long ago on "Radio Drama Revival" and listened to the whole series fairly quickly). After I retired that, I found out about "The Bright Sessions", another series that you must start at the beginning of.

[QUOTE=Uncwilly;495340]The History of English podcast might interest you then.[/QUOTE]
Thanks! Added to the list. Downloading/Torrenting. For those unable to google :razz:, [URL="http://historyofenglishpodcast.com/"]here is the link[/URL] (hopefully, I am getting the right thing).

[url=https://www.bbc.com/sport/tennis/45462014]US Open 2018: Naomi Osaka wins after Serena Williams outburst[/url] - BBC Sport

A great player, but sheesh, what an enormous sense of entitlement and the-rules-don't-apply-to-me-ness. For some reason I found this part especially galling:
[quote]Security staff ran on to the perimeter of the court as [umpire Carlos] Ramos walked off and the Portuguese did not return, as he would usually have done, for the trophy presentation.

More boos followed at the start of the ceremony, leading to Osaka pulling her visor down over her eyes to hide her tears.

Williams appealed for calm in her runner-up speech, asking her supporters to "give credit" to Osaka's achievement.[/quote]
"Give credit" - gosh, how magnanimous of her royal highness. Especially given that HRH was the one whose tantrum and umpire-threatening ended up overshadowing a great match from Osaka and ruining the joy the winner should have felt at her accomplishment. Serena stole something from Osaka which can never be restored. What a disgrace.

So, the umpire was another innocent victim?

[QUOTE=kladner;495813]So, the umpire was another innocent victim?[/QUOTE]
You [I]cannot[/I] be serious!

Umpire [i]threatening?[/i] Baloney.

Verbally abusive, yes. She deserved the penalties (IMO, smashing her raquet was especially egregious). It's a shame Naomi Osaka was denied the privilege of a clean win, by dint of Williams being assessed a game penalty after her rant.

I think, however, that her appeal for calm was a good thing. The crowd had gotten ugly. In baseball, the corresponding sentiment is, "We wuz robbed!" They felt the umpire had treated Ms. Williams "unfairly," and were booing the winner. This is why she appealed for them to "give credit." And the appeal did have the desired effect. They began applauding the winner.

Never mind John McEnroe. Imagine "always the best athlete" [i]Il Duce[/i] out on the tennis court, on the wrong end of a close line call...

[QUOTE=xilman;495815]You [I]cannot[/I] be serious![/QUOTE]
I wasn't. I should have put [SNARK] and [IRONY] tags on the remark.

[QUOTE=kladner;495839]I wasn't. I should have put [SNARK] and [IRONY] tags on the remark.[/QUOTE]

Whereas I flatly refused to put [ quote] [/ quote] around mine.

Sigh ...

[QUOTE=xilman;495855]Whereas I flatly refused to put [ quote] [/ quote] around mine.

Sigh ...[/QUOTE]
Sports have little allure for me. I had to look this line up.
[URL]https://www.independent.co.uk/sport/tennis/mcenroe-was-right-on-that-call-you-cannot-be-serious-809606.html[/URL]

EDIT: So why are my words in a box? :razz:

[QUOTE=Dr Sardonicus;495826]Umpire [i]threatening?[/i] Baloney.[/QUOTE]

How would you characterize "You will never be on a court of mine as long as you live"? Friendly banter?

[QUOTE=ewmayer;495867]Friendly banter?[/QUOTE]

No. But John McEnroe did similar things. Somehow it's different for women.

Not saying it's correct. For anyone.

[QUOTE=ewmayer;495867]How would you characterize "You will never be on a court of mine as long as you live"? Friendly banter?[/QUOTE]Not friendly, of course, but also not a threat. Note she said "court [i]of mine[/i]."

As a threat about officiating in tournaments she doesn't run, her remark makes no sense. She obviously has no say about who officiates at, for example, the U.S. Open. Yes, she could refuse to play if (say) Ramos were officiating, but then she'd either have to withdraw or forfeit.

OTOH, if "of mine" indicates ownership, it's something she could make stick. To me, that puts her remark on a par with, "You will never be welcome in my house."

Differently clued.
 

From the [URL="https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-leicestershire-45488294"]you couldn't make it up[/URL] department

[QUOTE=xilman;495908]From the [URL="https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-leicestershire-45488294"]you couldn't make it up[/URL] department[/QUOTE]
Haha, I love it... morons who believe they are cleverer than the rest of the society. I would hang him by his balls in the middle of the town so the people can see him, and keep him there for few days or so... (he gets discount on the fact that he didn't rape the old lady, otherwise it will be "till his death").

Honor among thieves
 

[QUOTE=xilman;495908]From the [URL="https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-leicestershire-45488294"]you couldn't make it up[/URL] department[/QUOTE]Hey, at least he didn't rat out his buddies. This could serve him in good stead during his extended stay as a Guest of the State...

[URL="https://www.reuters.com/article/us-eu-copyright/eu-lawmakers-back-publishers-over-tech-giants-on-copyright-idUSKCN1LS1QR"]EU "upload filter" passed EU parliament.
[/URL]


I have no words remaining...it´s afterall Bull****!

:confused::sick:

[QUOTE=MisterBitcoin;495964]I have no words remaining...it´s afterall Bull****![/QUOTE]

Jesus Flying Fsking Christ! (Please forgive my Canadian.)

The EU just don't have a clue, do they? Lot of people in suits, taking good salaries, making decisions without any knowledge....

[QUOTE=chalsall;495965]Jesus Flying Fsking Christ! (Please forgive my Canadian.)

The EU just don't have a clue, do they? Lot of people in suits, taking good salaries, making decisions without any knowledge....[/QUOTE]I don't know if it is the EU, One thing is sure : from one Disney rule to another the copyrights duration has gone from nothing, to 14 years after creation, to 100 years after the death or the author (which can be a company ! and companies never die, they also are "persons" but cannot be condemned to the same punishment as other "persons" : ever seen a company in prison ?)

Just as with patent law there is not much justice in the current law.

Jacob

[QUOTE=S485122;495966]One thing is sure : from one Disney rule to another...[/QUOTE]

Yeah. You are referring to the [URL="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copyright_Term_Extension_Act"]Copyright Term Extension Act[/URL] AKA the Mickey Mouse Protection Act (sponsored by Sonny Bono) enacted in the USofA.

Why the EU bent over and took this seems contrary to their claimed independence.

Perhaps they were told it would help protect their own artists (it won't), and they were dumb enough to believe it without critical thought nor analysis....

[QUOTE=S485122;495966]I don't know if it is the EU, One thing is sure : from one Disney rule to another the copyrights duration has gone from nothing, to 14 years after creation, to 100 years after the death or the author (which can be a company ! and companies never die, they also are "persons" but cannot be condemned to the same punishment as other "persons" : ever seen a company in prison ?)

Just as with patent law there is not much justice in the current law.

Jacob[/QUOTE]

I thought that with companies the copyright period was so many years after first publication.

To put a company in prison I'd have thought you would bang up the CEO or some other high-ranking officer(s) of the said company. That ought to concentrate the minds of the board of directors into getting their workers to obey the law. However, I have never seen that happen.

[QUOTE=BudgieJane;496021]I thought that with companies the copyright period was so many years after first publication.[/QUOTE]

Yeah. Under US of A law, 95 years after first publication, or 120 years after creation (whichever comes first).

Interestingly, Corporations were originally made "People" in order to facilitate the transfer of Patents and Copyrights to them. Originally these could only be owned by humans.

[QUOTE=MisterBitcoin;495964][URL="https://www.reuters.com/article/us-eu-copyright/eu-lawmakers-back-publishers-over-tech-giants-on-copyright-idUSKCN1LS1QR"]EU "upload filter" passed EU parliament. [/URL][/QUOTE]
Does this mean we can get webcams taken offline simply by showing them copyrighted material?

Is the European law stuff copyrighted? If we make a meme out of the EU copyright law, would they copystrike themselves?

[QUOTE=jasong;496218]Is the European law stuff copyrighted? If we make a meme out of the EU copyright law, would they copystrike themselves?[/QUOTE]
An interesting question, to which I do not yet have a good answer.

[QUOTE=xilman;496229]An interesting question, to which I do not yet have a good answer.[/QUOTE]A friend tweeted [url]http://ec.europa.eu/ipg/basics/legal/notice_copyright/index_en.htm[/url] in response to my question.

[QUOTE=xilman;496248]A friend tweeted [url]http://ec.europa.eu/ipg/basics/legal/notice_copyright/index_en.htm[/url] in response to my question.[/QUOTE]
I have this fantasy where I go back in time and make it so laws can only be passed if there's a flowchart associated with them that exactly duplicates the written rules.

Put another way, the laws would work like a computer program and opinions would only matter if they came from a jury. Matter in the legal sense, I mean.

In this age of the internet, I'm imagining a flowchart that's more than 2-dimensional, you'd only see the parts that are nearby.

Google is so infuriating
 

I know I depend on Google to find stuff, but that's one of the reasons I find them so infuriating.

I figured out that there's more than one "Jason Goatcher" account on Youtube, and I became curious. So I did a search for the channel "Jason Goatcher" to see the other channel.

The result comes back that nothing was found. Hmmmmm, so I try putting quotes around Jason Goatcher. Still nothing.

So, even though I know for a fact there are at least 2 accounts with the label "Jason Goatcher" for whatever reason Google doesn't want to supply either one to me.

[QUOTE=jasong;496467]I know I depend on Google to find stuff, but that's one of the reasons I find them so infuriating.

I figured out that there's more than one "Jason Goatcher" account on Youtube, and I became curious. So I did a search for the channel "Jason Goatcher" to see the other channel.

The result comes back that nothing was found. Hmmmmm, so I try putting quotes around Jason Goatcher. Still nothing.

So, even though I know for a fact there are at least 2 accounts with the label "Jason Goatcher" for whatever reason Google doesn't want to supply either one to me.[/QUOTE]

[url]https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCAAMYmaFk0cfC8ZmALy4v0Q?app=desktop[/url]
[url]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sh6FdIZTxY4&app=desktop[/url]

[QUOTE=science_man_88;496471][url]https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCAAMYmaFk0cfC8ZmALy4v0Q?app=desktop[/url]
[url]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sh6FdIZTxY4&app=desktop[/url][/QUOTE]
Thanks.

And just so people know, even though the channel is associated with a mental health place, that's not me in the video. I have zero musical talent.

Though the dude does remind me of my brother.

It's good to know that the extension office (responsible for publications, I suppose?) at the university I plan to attend has published an article on shooting cacti, according to Wikipedia:

[QUOTE]Cactus plugging is the practice of vandalizing or destroying a cactus, usually a saguaro, for fun. The Extension Office of the University of Arkansas says that the activity usually involves an inebriated person shooting at a cactus until it falls over.

In 1982, David Grundman was killed while cactus plugging. After shooting at a saguaro cactus he poked at it to try to make it fall over and caused an arm of the cactus, weighing 500 pounds (230 kg) to fall on him. The trunk of the cactus then also fell on him.

References
Klingaman, Gerald (December 12, 2008), Plant of the Week: Saguaro Cactus, University of Arkansas, archived from the original on April 5, 2013, retrieved 2013-02-13.[/QUOTE]

He should have waited 3 years and gotten a Darwin Award! :jvang:

I don't believe that the article's original website is still available, but here's archive.org: [url]https://web.archive.org/web/20130405230825/http://www.arhomeandgarden.org/plantoftheweek/articles/saguaro_cactus_12-12-08.htm[/url]

:davar55: good one! Cactus revenge!

[QUOTE=jvang;497461]It's good to know that the extension office (responsible for publications, I suppose?) at the university I plan to attend has published an article on shooting cacti, according to Wikipedia:



He should have waited 3 years and gotten a Darwin Award! :jvang:

I don't believe that the article's original website is still available, but here's archive.org: [url]https://web.archive.org/web/20130405230825/http://www.arhomeandgarden.org/plantoftheweek/articles/saguaro_cactus_12-12-08.htm[/url][/QUOTE]
Ah, yes, the Saguaro Revenge story. I heard this one not long after it happened. The columnist Mike Royko mentioned it in one of his "Gun Owner of the Year" columns. The story had already started to grow when I heard it told -- the version I heard had the guy shooting from a VW Beetle, and the cactus falling over and squashing him inside the car. Didn't happen that way, but him poking the damaged arm and having it fall on him is pretty good.

Or should this one be in the "dumb jokes" thread?
 

I bet a lot of folks at the UN found it risible.
[quote]Look at what has happened in two years with the United States on foreign policy. Now, the United States is respected. Countries may not like what we do, but they respect what we do. They know that if we say we’re going to do something, we follow it through.[/quote] -- Nikki Haley, in statement at press conference announcing her resignation, October 9, 2018

[QUOTE="https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2018/10/09/nikki-haley-says-us-is-now-respected-is-it/"]...
"That's right, because laughter is a sign of respect."[/QUOTE]
[COLOR="LemonChiffon"].[/COLOR]

[QUOTE=LaurV;497489]:davar55: good one! Cactus revenge![/QUOTE]

Yes- Also, back in the 1980s, I remember hearing about a student pilot of a glider (sailplane) that had too much speed on landing and was rolling too fast, hit a Saguaro cactus, which toppled over and killed him. That's from memory; happened at the gliderport north of Phoenix, Arizona. Given their size and weight, there are probably numerous other examples of Cactus Revenge.

Norm

What does "updated" mean, exactly?
 

Despite the [url=https://www.mersenne.org/]GIMPS home page[/url] having items dated as recently as April 2018, at the bottom of the page it says [quote]Last Updated January 19, 2016[/quote]

Looks ok from here.

[QUOTE=Uncwilly;498098]Looks ok from here.[/QUOTE]
Thanks to whoever made the necessary revision.

The unrevised date still be viewed, as the ghost of a departed quantity, in e.g. the Google cache of the site as of October 10 -- until they re-cache it.

Related, a link from the link from the article linked by jvang: (I didn't know the band, but I like them):


[YOUTUBE]e7y_9OCCqHM[/YOUTUBE]

From one of Rogue's science articles. Unfortunately, the forum is rejecting the .gif loop.
[URL]https://imgix.bustle.com/uploads/image/2018/9/28/68c1882d-ff7f-4992-af63-2d2b0050e0d3-giphy.gif?fm=mp4[/URL]

[QUOTE=kladner;498193]From one of Rogue's science articles. Unfortunately, the forum is rejecting the .gif loop.
[URL]https://imgix.bustle.com/uploads/image/2018/9/28/68c1882d-ff7f-4992-af63-2d2b0050e0d3-giphy.gif?fm=mp4[/URL][/QUOTE]You scratch my back and I'll scratch yours.

[QUOTE=retina;498194]You scratch my back and I'll scratch yours.[/QUOTE]
Looks that way to me!

[url=https://classic.dryang.org/japanese/teacher.html]Outpost Nine :: Editorials :: I am a Japanese School Teacher[/url]

[QUOTE=Spherical Cow;497891]Yes- Also, back in the 1980s, I remember hearing about a student pilot of a glider (sailplane) that had too much speed on landing and was rolling too fast, hit a Saguaro cactus, which toppled over and killed him. That's from memory; happened at the gliderport north of Phoenix, Arizona. Given their size and weight, there are probably numerous other examples of Cactus Revenge.

Norm[/QUOTE]
One of my brother is, or was, fond of hang gliding in West Texas. He came down too fast one time, in shorts, and got dragged through a patch of bull nettles.

He also said that vultures looked puzzled, if that is possible, to see him with his kite* riding the thermals.
*That's what he calls the glider.

The constitution of the Republic of Užupis is impressive.
(The duality of articles 23 and 24 is a genial reflection on the human nature.)

I would like to see all of it, preferably in regular text. What I can decipher and extrapolate, sounds somewhat like the [URL="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Church_of_the_SubGenius"]Church of the SubGenius[/URL]. [URL]http://subgenius.com/[/URL]
However, I really like, "A dog has [STRIKE]a[/STRIKE] the right to be a dog." :smile:

[QUOTE=kladner;498338]I would like to see all of it, preferably in regular text.[/QUOTE]
Easy-peasy! From [url=http://uzhupisembassy.eu/uzhupis-constitution/]Constitution of the Republic of Užupis[/url] (which has it in a number of languages), we have[quote]The Užupis Constitution terms:

1. Everyone has the right to live by the River Vilnele, and the River Vilnele has the right to flow by everyone.
2. Everyone has the right to hot water, heating in winter and a tiled roof.
3. Everyone has the right to die, but this is not an obligation.
4. Everyone has the right to make mistakes.
5. Everyone has the right to be unique.
6. Everyone has the right to love.
7. Everyone has the right not to be loved, but not necessarily.
8. Everyone has the right to be undistinguished and unknown.
9. Everyone has the right to idle.
10. Everyone has the right to love and take care of the cat.
11. Everyone has the right to look after the dog until one of them dies.
12. A dog has the right to be a dog.
13. A cat is not obliged to love its owner, but must help in time of nee.
14. Sometimes everyone has the right to be unaware of their duties.
15. Everyone has the right to be in doubt, but this is not an obligation.
16. Everyone has the right to be happy.
17. Everyone has the right to be unhappy.
18. Everyone has the right to be silent.
19. Everyone has the right to have faith.
20. No one has the right to violence.
21. Everyone has the right to appreciate their unimportance.
22. No one has the right to have a design on eternity.
23. Everyone has the right to understand.
24. Everyone has the right to understand nothing.
25. Everyone has the right to be of any nationality.
26. Everyone has the right to celebrate or not celebrate their birthday.
27. Everyone shall remember their name.
28. Everyone may share what they possess.
29. No one can share what they do not possess.
30. Everyone has the right to have brothers, sisters and parents.
31. Everyone may be independent.
32. Everyone is responsible for their freedom.
33. Everyone has the right to cry.
34. Everyone has the right to be misunderstood.
35. No one has the right to make another person guilty.
36. Everyone has the right to be individual.
37. Everyone has the right to have no rights.
38. Everyone has the right to not to be afraid.
(39. Do not defeat.
(40. Do not fight back.
(41. Do not surrender.

Some argue that the last three are mottos, not rights.

It was written in July 1998 by Thomas Chepaitis (Minister of Foreign Affairs of Uzhupis) and Romas Lileikis (President of Uzhupis)[/quote]I think #13 has a typo.

Thanks, Dr S!

13. "time of nee?" Is that an alternate spelling for the era of the [URL="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Knights_Who_Say_Ni"]Knights of Ni[/URL]?"

[QUOTE=EdH;498378]13. "time of nee?" Is that an alternate spelling for the era of the [URL="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Knights_Who_Say_Ni"]Knights of Ni[/URL]?"[/QUOTE]

My thought was that they intended 'née' but left off the accent. As in "if the female human of the household gives birth, the cat should help by bringing dead mice and such to the baby as food treats."

(As many cats are in fact wont to do in the presence of a crying baby - a great example of interspecies shared-values.)

[QUOTE=ewmayer;498380]My thought was that they intended 'née' but left off the accent. As in "if the female human of the household gives birth, the cat should help by bringing dead mice and such to the baby as food treats."

(As many cats are in fact wont to do in the presence of a crying baby - a great example of interspecies shared-values.)[/QUOTE]

it could also be "time of need."

[QUOTE=science_man_88;498382]it could also be "time of need."[/QUOTE]
Nah, proofreaders would have caught that, wouldn't they? I like ewmayer's response...

[QUOTE=EdH;498387]Nah, proofreaders would have caught that, wouldn't they?[/QUOTE][url=https://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-4113368/Illegally-parked-cars-fine-Hilarious-photos-capture-unfortunate-spelling-mistakes-signs-new-meaning.html]Yeah, you'd think[/url].

I vote for "in time of need." I think this sort of thing is in a play called [i]The Importance of Being in Context[/i].

Captain Sparklez, real name Jordan Moran, used to have a Youtube series named Mianite. When you type Mianite into Google, it auto-corrects to Moabite. Google tells us that a Moabite is a person that used to live near the land of Jordan, by the Dead Sea.

I've heard of circular reasoning, but this is the first time I've seen circular Google.

try google "recursion" :razz:

[QUOTE=LaurV;499426]try google "recursion" :razz:[/QUOTE]
Yeah, I expected as much.

When you enter "recursion" as a search, it replies "Do you mean 'recursion?'" with the exact same spelling.

I forget, what tech company has the address 1 Infinite Loop, is it Apple? Or maybe Google.

[QUOTE=jasong;499545]I forget, what tech company has the address 1 Infinite Loop, is it Apple? Or maybe Google.[/QUOTE]Google is your fiend.

[QUOTE=xilman;499656]Google is your fiend.[/QUOTE]
El Goog, I think you mean. Spanish for the evil one, or some such thing. Also, "Go Ogle." Both very appropriate.

Today's (11-07-2018) [i]Jeopardy![/i] had the following clue:

"In 1952 an early computer was used to discover the 13th Mersenne one of [b]these[/b] numbers."

The contestant said, "What is a Fibonacci number?"

[QUOTE=Dr Sardonicus;499857]Today's (11-07-2018) [I]Jeopardy![/I] had the following clue:

"In 1952 an early computer was used to discover the 13th Mersenne one of [B]these[/B] numbers."

The contestant said, "What is a Fibonacci number?"[/QUOTE]
Wrong answer, but a slightly informed guess. At least they knew a bit of math (but not much or enough.)

[QUOTE=Dr Sardonicus;499857]Today's (11-07-2018) ...[/QUOTE]Had me confused there for a moment. Hmmmm, today isn't in July I thought. Oh, yeah, that crazy middle endian date thing. Hmmmm.

[QUOTE=retina;499865]Had me confused there for a moment. Hmmmm, today isn't in July I thought. Oh, yeah, that crazy middle endian date thing. Hmmmm.[/QUOTE]
I have to say that the logic of 'y-m-d' date order is indisputable. They sort in the expected "correct" order, on computers, for starters.

Don't expect the US to give up on that date order, any more than on the English system of weights and measures..

[QUOTE=kladner;499867]I have to say that the logic of 'y-m-d' date order is indisputable. They sort in the expected "correct" order, on computers, for starters.[/QUOTE]
Yes, folks, you read it first on org.mersenneforum.www! :wink:

[QUOTE=Nick;499884]Yes, folks, you read it first on org.mersenneforum.www! :wink:[/QUOTE]

This doesn't sort the expected way. Neither does "www.mersenneforum.org", for that matter.

And namespaces in certain programming languages are implemented this way!

[QUOTE=axn;499885]This doesn't sort the expected way. Neither does "www.mersenneforum.org", for that matter.[/QUOTE]What way are you expecting?

[QUOTE=Nick;499884]Yes, folks, you read it first on org.mersenneforum.www! :wink:[/QUOTE]There was a time when my email address was [email]pcl@uk.ac.ox.robots[/email]

[QUOTE=retina;499892]What way are you expecting?[/QUOTE]

Something like...
[CODE]ftp.mersenneforum.com
www.mersenneforum.com
ftp.mersenneforum.org
www.mersenneforum.org
ftp.yahoo.com
www.yahoo.com
ftp.yahoo.org
www.yahoo.org
[/CODE]

[QUOTE=axn;499895]Something like...
[CODE]ftp.mersenneforum.com
www.mersenneforum.com
ftp.mersenneforum.org
www.mersenneforum.org
ftp.yahoo.com
www.yahoo.com
ftp.yahoo.org
www.yahoo.org
[/CODE][/QUOTE]I had never thought of website domain names to be an ordered list. But anyhow, it is not guaranteed that the same domain name with a different TLD belongs to the same entity.

[QUOTE=kladner;499867]I have to say that the logic of 'y-m-d' date order is indisputable. They sort in the expected "correct" order, on computers, for starters.

Don't expect the US to give up on that date order, any more than on the English system of weights and measures..[/QUOTE]In giving dates in dd-mm-yy(yy) format, the units proceed from smaller to larger. But this is merely [i]convention[/i] -- preference or custom -- not "logic." Giving the date as yy(yy)-mm-dd would be just as "logical." One could also give a date according to the lexicographic ordering of the phrases for the day of the week, the month, and the year. That too would be "logical," but not very practical.

And there are several different calendars in current use. The Gregorian calendar is perhaps the most widely used, certainly so in commerce. The names of the months in the Gregorian calendar reflect a change from the old Roman calendar, when the new year was deemed to begin with Spring, and winter wasn't on the calendar. That's why the numerical prefixes for the months September to December indicate two less than the number of the month in succeeding calendars, up until the Gregorian.

With the notable exception of the Islamic calendar, adjustments have been devised for modern calendars to keep them synchronized with the seasons. This too is convention, not "logic."

Here in the good old U-S-of-A, it is customary to give dates in month-day-year format. This is reflected in, for example, President Roosevelt's address to Congress the day after the attack on Pearl Harbor: "Yesterday, December seventh, nineteen forty-one,..." It may seem unsatisfactory in that the units don't proceed according to size, but at least it is consistent. But there is a conspicuous exception to this custom in a commonly-used name for the national holiday commemorating the signing of the Declaration of Independence -- the Fourth of July.

As to weights and measures, it may be noteworthy that after France mandated use the metric system, it caused a lot of confusion, because people in every locality [i]also[/i] kept using their customary systems. France finally had to mandate the [i]exclusive[/i] use of the metric system. Enacting that sort of measure would be difficult here in the USA.

There is also a practical difficulty now which did not exist -- or at least, not to nearly as large a degree -- in the mid-Nineteenth Century: just think of the amount of machinery, infrastructure, and construction in place, which was designed and built under the English system -- diameters of pipes, screws, nuts and bolts. Threads per inch. And on and on. You can't just wave a wand and change all of that stuff. If you want to have the metric system used exclusively here, you need to deal with that "inertia" problem.

The default *nix "date" command defies all logic. :loco:[code]~ date
Tue 15 Nov 12:34:56 +00 2016[/code]Try to sort that in some logical way!

[size=1]At least it doesn't use the AM/PM thing. That would've made it even worse.[/size]

[QUOTE=retina;499900]The default *nix "date" command defies all logic. :loco:[code]~ date
Tue 15 Nov 12:34:56 +00 2016[/code]Try to sort that in some logical way!

[size=1]At least it doesn't use the AM/PM thing. That would've made it even worse.[/size][/QUOTE]
Convert to the [url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Julian_day]Julian day[/url], and thence Julian date (Julian day number plus fraction of day).

I note that the date you give is almost two years ago. Perhaps your machine decided it did not want to go on, a week after the 2016 election?

[QUOTE=Dr Sardonicus;499948]Convert to the [url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Julian_day]Julian day[/url], and thence Julian date (Julian day number plus fraction of day).[/QUOTE]There are lots of alternative formats. And picking [i]any[/i] of them would probably have been preferred to the one that [u]date[/u] outputs. What were they thinking? :loco:[QUOTE=Dr Sardonicus;499948]I note that the date you give is almost two years ago. Perhaps your machine decided it did not want to go on, a week after the 2016 election?[/QUOTE]Other countries exist. It's a long story to explain the ~2yr delay, but it has nothing to do with the election process in a country that uses those crazy date formats.

[QUOTE=retina;499963]There are lots of alternative formats. And picking [i]any[/i] of them would probably have been preferred to the one that [u]date[/u] outputs. What were they thinking? :loco:[/quote]That's a question best addressed to the people who first wrote the code.

(Looks at manual) Hmm. For purposes of sorting dates since January 1, 1970 00:00 UTC, it appears that

date -j -f "%a %b %d %T %Z %Y" "`date`" "+%s"

fills the bill. It converts the date to the number of seconds since that time.

[quote]Other countries exist. It's a long story to explain the ~2yr delay, but it has nothing to do with the election process in a country that uses those crazy date formats.[/QUOTE]Hmm. It's a curious thing, that date being off by almost two years. (I am discounting the possibility that might prompt the reply, "Pull the other one. It's got bells on it.")

The two obvious possibilities for how it could have got that way are, (1) it's deliberately set that way (why it would be, I have no idea), or (2) for some reason, "time stopped" on that computer for almost two years -- perhaps it was powered down for that long and the date stayed where it was when the plug got pulled; and after power was restored, time resumed at that point, and the date was never reset. [i]Why[/i] it would not have been reset is something I can't fathom. Perhaps resetting it would simply upset too many apple carts...

[QUOTE=Dr Sardonicus;499973](Looks at manual) Hmm. For purposes of sorting dates since January 1, 1970 00:00 UTC, it appears that

date -j -f "%a %b %d %T %Z %Y" "`date`" "+%s"

fills the bill. It converts the date to the number of seconds since that time.[/QUOTE]Yes indeed. That is so much easier than having a default do that for us. :rolleyes:[QUOTE=Dr Sardonicus;499973]Hmm. It's a curious thing, that date being off by almost two years. (I am discounting the possibility that might prompt the reply, "Pull the other one. It's got bells on it.")

The two obvious possibilities for how it could have got that way are, (1) it's deliberately set that way (why it would be, I have no idea), or (2) for some reason, "time stopped" on that computer for almost two years -- perhaps it was powered down for that long and the date stayed where it was when the plug got pulled; and after power was restored, time resumed at that point, and the date was never reset. [i]Why[/i] it would not have been reset is something I can't fathom. Perhaps resetting it would simply upset too many apple carts...[/QUOTE]Hehe, well then perhaps I'll just let you speculate. There is a good reason actually.

[QUOTE=retina;499975]Yes indeed. That is so much easier than having a default do that for us. :rolleyes:Hehe, well then perhaps I'll just let you speculate. There is a good reason actually.[/QUOTE]
my guess is to stop updates you don't want.

[QUOTE=retina;499975]Hehe, well then perhaps I'll just let you speculate. There is a good reason actually.[/QUOTE]You don't wish to pay to renew an expired software license?

(scoffing at proffered date command gleaned from manual) [QUOTE=retina;499975]Yes indeed. That is so much easier than having a default do that for us. :rolleyes:[/quote]Well, the commands of UNIX (and its avatars) have never been known as being "user-friendly." If you ask the question, "Why does it display the date the way it does?" I can not give you an answer. You can speculate or do some research, your choice. If you need to sort system dates, you're basically stuck with using what the system provides for the purpose. I'm sure there are things that would be better for sorting dates in specific contexts that what I found in a few minutes of looking at a manual.

(scoffing at speculation about system date anomaly) [quote]Hehe, well then perhaps I'll just let you speculate. There is a good reason actually.[/QUOTE]Between "It's a long story" and "There is a good reason actually" my curiosity is sufficiently satisfied that I don't feel the need to speculate. Besides -- I lack sufficient data. In particular, I don't know whether the system date is kept (nearly) constant, or is offset from "real" time by a (nearly) constant amount.

[URL="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_paradoxes"]List of paradoxes[/URL]

[QUOTE=science_man_88;499986]my guess is to stop updates you don't want.[/QUOTE]No. But I'm not sure how setting a date in the past makes the system think future updates are all done?[QUOTE=xilman;500013]You don't wish to pay to renew an expired software license?[/QUOTE]No. I have no issues with paying for licenses and whatnot if the code is useful and it would cost me more to hire minions to update things for me.[QUOTE=Dr Sardonicus;500023](scoffing at speculation about system date anomaly) Between "It's a long story" and "There is a good reason actually" my curiosity is sufficiently satisfied that I don't feel the need to speculate. Besides -- I lack sufficient data. In particular, I don't know whether the system date is kept (nearly) constant, or is offset from "real" time by a (nearly) constant amount.[/QUOTE]The difference might be a permanent offset, or a temporary offset, or a gradually increasing or decreasing offset, or a moment fixed in the past.[QUOTE=Dr Sardonicus;500023](scoffing at proffered date command gleaned from manual) Well, the commands of UNIX (and its avatars) have never been known as being "user-friendly." If you ask the question, "Why does it display the date the way it does?" I can not give you an answer. You can speculate or do some research, your choice. [/QUOTE]My question was meant to be rhetorical, and somewhat sarcastic also.[QUOTE=Dr Sardonicus;500023]If you need to sort system dates, you're basically stuck with using what the system provides for the purpose. I'm sure there are things that would be better for sorting dates in specific contexts that what I found in a few minutes of looking at a manual.[/QUOTE][u]Date[/u] has many options for customising the output. I think everyone already realises that. But the [i]default[/i] is basically useless. I just think that at the very least, to make the code look a bit more professional, the default output could have been made more logically ordered. And of course for [strike]hysterical[/strike] historical reasons it can never be changed, ever. :sad:

Ye all OCD people trying to "sort" al kind of thingies in "logic" and "expected" order... :razz:

The physics or math behind moving sidewalks shouldn't be that hard
 

Just to satisfy my curiosity whenever I am on a moving sidewalk or escalator I test the synchronization of the floor to the handrails. To me that should be a given for safety or stability.

But I can proclaim that after testing dozens and dozens in my travels I have noted about a 1% pass rate.

Where's Sheldon when you need him?