[QUOTE=garo;381280]Hats off to you tha-Goebbels![/QUOTE]

You have failed to read the text I posted. The rewording of it by you turnes it 180 degrees different and that it what you protest against. Proof that you can read what I posted and you may get a reply.

[QUOTE=tha;381289]You have failed to read the text I posted. The rewording of it by you turnes it 180 degrees different and that it what you protest against. Proof that you can read what I posted and you may get a reply.[/QUOTE]
Well, maybe you didn't make yourself clear enough. Garo is not the only person here who may have misunderstood you.

The fact that Israel has shelters to protect its citizens from bombing whereas Palestinians in Gaza do not, is well documented. But can you justify your statement that Palestinians do not [U]need[/U] shelters?

Throwing this into the mix ...

[url="http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-28916761"]More than 300 Holocaust survivors and their descendants have issued a statement condemning what they call Israel's "genocide" in Gaza.[/url]

[QUOTE=Brian-E;381292]The fact that Israel has shelters to protect its citizens from bombing whereas Palestinians in Gaza do not, is well documented. But can you justify your statement that Palestinians do not [U]need[/U] shelters?[/QUOTE]

Whether or not the people in the Gaza strip need shelters is entirely up to themselves. They have not build ones, which was either because those who rule the place did not allow them to be build or because no one took the effort to build them. There are many shelters though in Gaza and they are deep underground. Unfortunately they are only available to the Hamas ranks.

Israel has the civilians in the shelters and the army in the fields. In the Gaza strip it just the other way around.

In this war we see that people in Gaza trust the Israeli army to hit the targets with very high accuracy. They do not think they need to go to shelters because they will be warned. You can find a [URL="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vdULPgX5mR0"]nice example[/URL] here on youtube. The phone call makes the people in the street go stand on the roof with a mobile phone, rather than get moving.

Tha, I'm just gonna ignore your latest Hasbara propaganda-spew, but I notice you still haven't answered garo's question as to how many Israelis have actually died in the past [pick a time frame] as a result of those "dangerous Hamas terrorist rockets". Surely you must have an app that provides that number?

Also note that Israelis have little need of those bomb shelters you mention, because

[a] The vast majority of Hamas rockets land outside of densely populated areas, and

[b] If Israeli propaganda is to be believed, any that do possess a threatening flight path are promptly neutralized by the miraculous "Iron Dome" defense system.

Lastly, I want to hear some details of that "desert army uniform" of which you are so proud - which installment of "Iraq War theater", where deployed, and what duties? This is a Netherlands army uniform, not IDF, right?

[QUOTE=tha;381289]You have failed to read the text I posted. The rewording of it by you turnes it 180 degrees different and that it what you protest against. Proof that you can read what I posted and you may get a reply.[/QUOTE]

I apologize for the Goebbels remark. It was needless.

I can also see the point you have clarified in subsequent posts that Palestinians don't need shelter because they are warned. So I agree that I misunderstood your statement. However, I still take issue with your statement that the Palestinians don't need shelters. It should be evident from the respective death tolls from both sides - something you continue gloss to over - that the Palestinians need shelters more than the Israelis.

Your apps and your phone calls - tell that to the parents of the hundreds of children that have been killed. And I wonder what the death toll would have been if the Israeli Army was less accurate.

[QUOTE=ewmayer;381312]Tha, I'm just gonna ignore your latest Hasbara propaganda-spew, but I notice you still haven't answered garo's question as to how many Israelis have actually died in the past [pick a time frame] as a result of those "dangerous Hamas terrorist rockets". Surely you must have an app that provides that number?

Also note that Israelis have little need of those bomb shelters you mention, because

[a] The vast majority of Hamas rockets land outside of densely populated areas, and

[b] If Israeli propaganda is to be believed, any that do possess a threatening flight path are promptly neutralized by the miraculous "Iron Dome" defense system.

Lastly, I want to hear some details of that "desert army uniform" of which you are so proud - which installment of "Iraq War theater", where deployed, and what duties? This is a Netherlands army uniform, not IDF, right?[/QUOTE]

Once again, I believe I already stated it a few times before, this is an asymmetric war. If both parties had the same objectives and the same weapons and the same attitudes, than the number of dead may be used as a scoreboard. But then again, if they had they would probably playing football or soccer and not go to war with each other.

Do you think if someone enters a shopping mall and starts to shoot an incredible number of bullets in random directions a police officer is going to care about the number of casualties made, if any? The policeman may shoot only one time and still make more casualties, namely one. I still think he should be applauded for doing his duty in the line of fire. He may even kill a bystander, a child used as shield by the shooter. It may still be the best possible outcome.

You may want to use your number of dead policies in the IS-Syria war. Both target each others military and the civilian population alike. Notice that the numbers are staggering high on both sides.

Critics of the present Israeli strategies say that Hamas is 'winning' because it is able to continue its ability to disrupt the Israeli society despite having lost on the battlefield. It will win if it is allowed to shelter behind the civilians of Gaza and at the same time shoot rockets.

How many rockets land in non residential territory is irrelevant. The alarm will go off and you will need to get into the shelters. It is doubted whether Israeli schools will be able to start next week.

The Iron Dome works well, but each anti-missile shot costs a lot of money. It is a purely defensive weapon by nature and cannot be used in an offensive way. I would take Europe a lot more serious if they would offer to pay half of all missiles fired just like the US.

My army uniform is Dutch, but I do value my Israeli patches given. Duties were mostly liaison.

[QUOTE=garo;381313]I apologize for the Goebbels remark. It was needless.

I can also see the point you have clarified in subsequent posts that Palestinians don't need shelter because they are warned. So I agree that I misunderstood your statement. However, I still take issue with your statement that the Palestinians don't need shelters. It should be evident from the respective death tolls from both sides - something you continue gloss to over - that the Palestinians need shelters more than the Israelis.

Your apps and your phone calls - tell that to the parents of the hundreds of children that have been killed. And I wonder what the death toll would have been if the Israeli Army was less accurate.[/QUOTE]

I accept your apologies.

Where-ever the Gaza civilians have taken shelter in the past years, that is where the rockets and multi miles guns were fired from. So best practice would be to disperse as much as possible rather than assemble anywhere. My advice to the people of Gaza would be to stay clear of weapon caches, launch sites (can be set up on location in minutes, so always be aware of your surroundings) and armed fighters. Do not assemble anywhere, just disperse. You are safe from Israeli fire. And actually this is what they do, they figured this out themselves fairly quickly.

Actually a lot of fighting between Hamas and Fatah in the early years was because Hamas used to set up launch sites in areas controlled by other tribes than their own men were from. Gaza is far from a single population. It is an amalgam of tribes.

[url]http://mobile.nytimes.com/2014/09/01/world/middleeast/israel-claims-nearly-1000-acres-of-west-bank-land-near-bethlehem.html[/url]

The actions of someone who wants peace. Oh yeah! Take that Iran! Landgrabbers r us!

[url]http://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-29179655[/url]

[url]http://time.com/3571776/icc-israel-2010-gaza-flotilla-raid/[/url]