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-   -   Colab Pro Plus (https://www.mersenneforum.org/showthread.php?t=27124)

mognuts 2021-08-13 10:48

Colab Pro Plus
 
Has anybody tried Colab Pro+ yet? It seems quite expensive at $50 (£38.25) per month and doesn't seem to offer many more advantages over Colab and Colab Pro.

According to the sign up blurb:
[LIST][*]Background execution[*]Notebooks keep working even after you close your browser.[*]Faster GPUs[*]Priority access to faster GPUs and TPUs means that you spend less time waiting while your code is running.[*]Even more memory[*]Significantly more memory than ever before.[*]Even longer runtimes[*]Gives you the longest running notebooks in Colab so you are able to get your work done.[/LIST]
It's all a bit vague.

axn 2021-08-13 11:56

[QUOTE=mognuts;585553]It's all a bit vague.[/QUOTE]

Looks like an attempt at market segmentation aka cash grab.

Chuck 2021-08-13 12:46

I'm a glutton for punishment. I just subscribed to Pro+. I opened two notebooks (each receiving a P100) and it would not allow opening a third "...you have too many open sessions"

mognuts 2021-08-13 12:59

Personally, I would be happy to pay extra for a more powerful GPU and CPU, longer runtimes and more sessions but Colab don't seem to want to offer this. Colab Pro Plus looks like what Colab Pro used to be a few months ago and Colab Pro now looks like what the free Colab used to be when it first launched

LaurV 2021-09-05 09:29

I split this discussion about Pro+ into a separate thread, from the factoring tools thread, as it was cluttering there, and the subject deserves a discussion on its own.

We (as in royal we, but also as in nominative first person plural pronoun, see further referring to the fact that we run more accounts) used (and still use, but not for long) Pro. We mean normal pro, not plus, $10 bucks per month per account, [U]more than one account[/U] (as many real people as we could grab into this, and who could give us access to their gugu-drive, otherwise unused - people need to be real because Gugu is checking - they know everything! - albeit we pay with the same credit card for all accounts, I guess it is not their business who pays for who).

We posted [URL="https://mersenneforum.org/showthread.php?p=587050"]here[/URL] and [URL="https://mersenneforum.org/showthread.php?p=587295"]here[/URL] our opinion about "Pro+", and same as axn said above, we think this is just a tentative from Gugu to get more money for the same resources. Thinking objectively, they are still the cheapest around, when you compare with Amazon's EC2 or Alibaba's stuff, where you have to spend few hundred bucks per month for the same resources.

Nevertheless, Gugu's move just hit us ("us" like in the number-hunting-community) under the belt with the move. Now for the same resources, you need to pay 5 times more money.

There is a [URL="https://towardsdatascience.com/google-colab-pro-is-it-worth-49-99-c542770b8e56"]nice article here[/URL] which talks about the differences between the subscription types, except that the article was a bit premature, just days after the Pro+ went public, and the writer didn't do his full homework (i.e. most probably he didn't use any subscription at the time, or before, but just hurried to wrote from what he heard around, afraid that somebody else will write it before him; he should have waited few days and test the subscriptions). For example, at the time the article was written, we were getting V100 cards on [U][B]all[/B][/U] Pro accounts, as the PrimeNet reports proves it (the JSON result lines from gpuOwl contain the card type, and that can't be cheated unless we re-compute the checksums), but the table in the article mentions nothing about V100, which is about 1.8 times faster than a P100 for P-1/PRP, about 4 times faster at TF compared with the same P100, about 2.6 times faster than a T4 at TF, and about 12 times (twelve, no typo) faster than a T4 at P-1/PRP.

Anyhow, the article is, say, reasonable accurate with the description, except that the table has to be modified a bit.

For example, the GPU: Before introducing Pro+, a free tier would get the "half K80" (nothing mentioned anywhere in Gugu about the "half" part, but K80 is a dual card, and according with the (low) performance we witness, you don't get the full K80, but only a half of it!), the P4 (not mentioned anywhere in the article, this is better than the half-K80 at TF, but worse at PRP/P-1), and the T4, which is very good at TF (1600 to 1900 GHzDays/Day, depending on range and bitlevel, and also the CPU is paired with on colab). The difference would be that T4 tends to only last 4 hours or less, maximum 8, while the other 2 you can have reasonably for 12 hours, like in the table. This didn't change much after Pro+ was introduced. You still can get occasional T4 with free accounts, it seems they have lots of T4 there. The big difference is for Pro users, who were getting Voltas before, and P100 only after you use too much of a Volta. Now, those goodies moved to Pro+, while the Pro users only get mostly T4 and sometimes P100. Since August 17th, I have seen 6 times K80 and 4 times P4, which I got rid of, with repeated trials of "factory reset", but no V100 anymore. In the last week, I could count P100 on my fingers, and in the last few days I got none, on three Pro accounts. They were all T4, and if I insisted with "factory reset" they would start giving me K80s, so I would have to reset again to get the T4 back, and then do TF.

Related to the memory and running time, the table is also a bit off. Free users are interrupted MUCH often than the 12 hours, and there is no "high memory instance" for them, while for the Pro users the instances will last indeed 24 hours almost always, but as said, you don't get P100, and the memory is only 16G. To get the 32G mentioned in the table, you MUST choose the "high memory instance" (from the menu, "Runtime/Change Runtime Type/Runtime Shape/select the High RAM option) but those instances tend to only stay alive half of the time, and they don't worth the effort, as the RAM only affects the CPU, which is anyhow not doing much, comparing with the GPU - but well, you may need it if you want to run P-1 Stage 2 or ECM in the CPU during crunching twoks with the GPU, or whatever sails your boat.

For the Pro+ instances, you get now the Voltas that were before under "normal" Pro, but you pay 5 times more for them, and they tend to stay alive 36 or even 48 hours (not 24, the author was even unlucky, or he didn't test, as I said above, or he knew something we don't know, i.e. Gugu may want to reduce the times in the future after it catches the gullible guys like us, hehe). Also, the 52G of RAM you only get if you choose "High RAM" instances, which tend to be interrupted after 24 hours (maybe he was referring to that, in the table). Otherwise you only get 16G or 32G, which seems random (up to your luck).

So, you can judge for yourself if it worth.

Note that I am running many (I mean MANY) Pro accounts, but I have no Pro+ account. The info I know is from friends. One such friend says he got an A100 with Pro+, but I have no confirmation on that, and I suspect he was teasing me (he would!).

petrw1 2021-09-05 15:46

[QUOTE=LaurV;587307]I split this discussion about Pro+ into a separate thread, blah ... blah ... blah ... blah).[/QUOTE]

So it not just me that sends world record forum messages.
:blahblahblah:
:razz:
:missingteeth:

PS ... back on topic.
I'm running 3 colab (cheapskate/free) sessions.
With the demise of P100 I am now getting K80 (or a half) virtually every time I ask for a GPU.

slandrum 2021-09-05 18:23

I'm running several free accounts. For a while now they only get K80's (one day two of my accounts got T4's, and the rest got K80s). So that seems to be all you'll get with free accounts now - at least all that I can get, but it may be affected by how often I'm running them. The CPU only instances still seem to about the same mix of processors except that the AMD seems to come up more frequently now.

LaurV 2021-09-07 15:27

If you have a Colab Pro account and, in the light of the last evolution of the things, got the idea to unsubscribe (i.e. stop the payments for the next months) [U][B]DON'T do that[/B][/U],[B][U] until the last day of your (monthly) subscription[/U][/B].

We unsubscribed from 3 Pro accounts yesterday, i.e. stopped the payments for the following months, but for this month the money are already paid, and all of the accounts are still "Pro" till the current subscription period ends (on October). However, immediately after that, we lost the T4 cards on all the accounts in the following hours, and couldn't get [U][B]ANY[/B][/U] GPU, for more than 30 hours, it says that there are none available, in spite of the fact that the account is still Pro, and we connected with two (different) free accounts that both got k80s (kicked out after 3-4 hours, but yet, WTF?!...)

This evening, one of the Pro got a T4 kicked out after 19 minutes (did TF with Chris), and another one got a K80 which is still running P-1 for about half hour (still going). The third one has yet to be successful in getting a GPU, after a lot of trials.

So, if you were thinking about stopping your subscription, do that in the last day of the period. Gugu is a bitch...

kriesel 2021-09-07 15:58

[QUOTE=LaurV;587447]If you have a Colab Pro account and, in the light of the last evolution of the things, got the idea to unsubscribe (i.e. stop the payments for the next months) [U][B]DON'T do that[/B][/U],[B][U] until the last day of your (monthly) subscription[/U][/B].[/QUOTE]Or the day before or so, to avoid getting billed for a month more than intended, due to time zone differences, processing delays or seller perversity. (Got stuck that way on an online account once. Even once got a letter warning of possible foreclosure. The lender had received the payment, and it was sitting in their employee's work area unprocessed, during their long vacation.)

LaurV 2021-09-07 17:01

Yes, right. :tu:
The day before, is better, albeit you can see exactly the billing cycle in your account page, and (un)subscribing takes a minute only, sh!t may happen if you do it in the last minute, and they may charge you one more month "by accident" before cutting you off.

Chuck 2021-09-08 03:47

Cancelling near end of first month
 
I had hoped that for $50/month I might get better hardware with Pro+ than with the previous Pro, but tonight it looks like time to leave. I had consistently been getting two 24-hour sessions each day with no worse than two P100 cards, and occasionally two V100s. Sometimes T4s were in the mix. Tonight when I started the next day's sessions I got K80s. That's unacceptable for this premium price, so I killed the two sessions and I have to say goodbye to Colab again. It was a good three week run.

chalsall 2021-09-08 14:19

[QUOTE=Chuck;587486]I had hoped that for $50/month I might get better hardware with Pro+ than with the previous Pro, but tonight it looks like time to leave.[/QUOTE]

Very sorry to hear that. But thanks very much for your contributions!

Just out of interest... Did you try experimenting with the "Factory Reset" option when you were given sub-optimal GPUs?

ATH 2021-09-08 16:20

[QUOTE=Chuck;587486]I had hoped that for $50/month I might get better hardware with Pro+ than with the previous Pro, but tonight it looks like time to leave. I had consistently been getting two 24-hour sessions each day with no worse than two P100 cards, and occasionally two V100s. Sometimes T4s were in the mix. Tonight when I started the next day's sessions I got K80s. That's unacceptable for this premium price, so I killed the two sessions and I have to say goodbye to Colab again. It was a good three week run.[/QUOTE]

I think you need to restart sessions completely after upgrading, and maybe it takes a little bit of time as well.

I was starting to get mostly T4's with occasional P100 on Pro nonplus(sed), and then I upgraded to Pro+ I immediately got 2x T4s again on Pro+. But the next day and since then, I have been getting V100's and a few P100, so I think I should have reset those 2x T4s sessions completely that first night and restarted, or maybe it just takes a day for it to update.

Even though it seems like a hard blow from $10 to $50 per month, I do think it is just a case of us being used to "too good to be true" until now. Last year when I started on normal Pro I was running 3 sessions P100 for 20-24 hours a day for $10 per months, so 1800-2160 hours of P100 for $10. Then later you could "only" get 2 sessions for 20+ hours or 3 sessions for much shorter but instead you could get V100s as well.

$50 isn't even enough to cover the power cost if I run 2 sessions P100/V100 for 20-24 hours per day, so 1200-1440 hours per months or 3.5-4.2 cents/hour.

Chuck 2021-09-08 19:57

[QUOTE=chalsall;587505]Very sorry to hear that. But thanks very much for your contributions!

Just out of interest... Did you try experimenting with the "Factory Reset" option when you were given sub-optimal GPUs?[/QUOTE]

Yes; I "factory reset" twice on each of the two sessions receiving K80s, and was given another K80 each time.

Chuck 2021-09-08 20:05

1 Attachment(s)
[QUOTE=ATH;587511]Even though it seems like a hard blow from $10 to $50 per month, I do think it is just a case of us being used to "too good to be true" until now. Last year when I started on normal Pro I was running 3 sessions P100 for 20-24 hours a day for $10 per months, so 1800-2160 hours of P100 for $10. Then later you could "only" get 2 sessions for 20+ hours or 3 sessions for much shorter but instead you could get V100s as well.

$50 isn't even enough to cover the power cost if I run 2 sessions P100/V100 for 20-24 hours per day, so 1200-1440 hours per months or 3.5-4.2 cents/hour.[/QUOTE]

I figured I was saving about $20/month electricity not running my own 1080ti GPU, and also not having the additional heat load in the room. Also the elimination of fan noise was worth something to me.

The graph from Challsall's site gives a good visual of the work I accomplished in three weeks of Pro+ (the blue to the right side).

joejoefla 2021-10-31 03:12

[QUOTE=Chuck;587517]Yes; I "factory reset" twice on each of the two sessions receiving K80s, and was given another K80 each time.[/QUOTE]

I'm having a hard time where after several days (Colab Pro+) I'm getting no GPU available.

LaurV 2021-10-31 05:41

I got bitten too, and contributed to Pro+ with a single account. First disappointment was that the price doesn't include taxes (which is actually written in small print somewhere) so I received a higher bill than written on site. This is common for Thailand and Singapore (where the Gluglu server is) but it was not like that in the past with none of my Pro (not plus) accounts. So it got me by surprise a little.

Then I got A100 three times in the beginning, which lasted respectively 16 hours, 24 hours, and 8 hours.

I was almost ready to praise the Pro+ account, but luckily I kept my mouth shut for some more time. Because after that, I could not get anything else than P100, for the next about 20 days. No A100, no V100, no lower card. Only P100. But I got this quite regular (i.e. each time I requested a GPU, it was a P100, never got the "no GPU" message) and it lasted everything between 3 hours and 30 hours (yes, few times it lasted longer than 24 hours).

If it broke during the night, without me realizing it in the evening, then there would be no new session until morning when I woke up (no "automated" connection, I did everything manually). Sometimes, if I realized before going to bed that the time will expire overnight, I would break the session, wait 10 minutes, and connect again, to be sure that the time doesn't expire during I was sleeping. But sometimes I forgot to do that.

During the day I would watch it and restart it in minutes (my usual day means like 14-16 hours in average, in front of the monitor) or mostly half hour after it expires.

Good point about Pro and Pro+ is the availability of the Terminal. You can do a lot of things with it, like delete temporary checkpoints and clutter, transfer files, maintenance, rights, and even "sudo apt-get install mc", hihi, :lol: my favorite file manager, which works amazingly well (and unexpected) in Colab terminal.

Bad points is that you pay a lot of money for nothing. Or almost. If you compare with other offers available around, it is still a bit cheaper per GPU, but the others you can use for whatever you want (including mining) while Colab is quite restrictive. You may also need to consider that "the others" will give you 8 or 16 times more CPU cores per each GPU, while Colab only gives you one CPU core per GPU, so the price per resource is not so different as it seems.

Gluglu also don't state clear their terms, but that of course, is deliberate, they make some smoke with those rules so you shouldn't be sure what you get for the money you pay. Which sucks.

One "interesting" aspect (and somehow [U][B]important[/B][/U]) is the fact that the [B][U]"factory reset" won't really work for Pro+[/U][/B]. Once you got the GPU, you are stuck with it until it expires, or they will take it away if you don't use it for a while. They do a lot of advertising of the fact that in Pro+, as opposite of Free and Pro (not plus), [U]the sessions run even after you disconnect the browser[/U]. In fact, this is the [U][B]only [/B][/U]"real" upgrade from Pro to Pro+. There is no other advantage. And for this, you pay 45 bucks (plus taxes) instead of 10 bucks (plus taxes) per month, per account. You [U]don't [/U]really get a better GPU, and you [U]don't [/U]really get longer running times, because all these are subject to "availability" (which you can't see, anyhow; they will give you what they want). But you really [U]do get sessions which run "in background"[/U] even after you disconnect the browser, or your internet crashes for a while (happens here frequently, especially in the rainy season). But his is [U][B]a double edge sword[/B][/U]. Because now, yeah, it is good that you don't waste the computing time when your browser crashes, and don't waste the clicks to reconnect, but in the same time, [U][B]you can not reset a session[/B][/U]. When you click "factory reset" it looks like the session is gone, but then you reconnect and get the same GPU. You can try 100 times, the result would be the same. Then, accidentally, you open a Terminal (didn't I tell you this is very useful?) and type "uptime" and you see "7 hours" or "13 hours", or whatever time you had since you launched the current session [U][B]before[/B][/U] using factory reset. So, the factory reset sucks, they took a good step so you can not change the GPU with that.

Here is Singapore server. YMMV.

The account will expire on Nov 5th. It will not be renewed.
.

ATH 2021-10-31 07:52

For several weaks I got only T4s on Pro+, and I was not going to renew, but last 1-2 weeks it is better.
On one account I'm getting mostly V100 each time with 2-3 A100, on the other I get mostly P100 with a few V100. Not sure why it is so different between the 2 accounts.

LaurV 2022-01-03 05:47

Whoops... I did it again... (reopen colab pro plus in Dec 2021)
 
google colab guys (intentional lower cases) show again how assholes they are, I still have 5 days of colab [U]pro [B]plus[/B][/U], but I checked the button with "I don't want to extend it for the next months", and in just 20 minutes they disconnected me, and I could not get a GPU in the last ~14 hours, the multisession wont work (it never worked too reliable anyhow, in this part of the world, I believe I am connected to S'pore servers), the "terminal" (yep! the [U][B]terminal[/B][/U], that is why I paid for "pro", and that doesn't need ANY resources to work, unless you type crazy commands in it AFTER you open it) doesn't work, it says "not available", etc, and the (single-cpu-core) session I can still open behaves in [U]ALL aspects[/U] as a free colab. I mean, FREE, not just pro (without plus). And I have the "plus" one (which gave me A100 in the first day for about 16 hours, and then P100 for the next ~20 days, with interruptions here and there, but it was generally working satisfactory for the money) for which I paid few times the price of a pro, PLUS the VAT tax (hidden cost, they added this from last autumn or so, I already complained about it here around, before that it was "what you see is what you pay", but now it is "what you pay when the bill comes, is more than what you see when checking out").

Yeah, well, I know I said it before, don't cut their money till the last minute, otherwise they will show you their asshole side. But I am getting old and forgetful, and I wanted to be sure that they won't renew it (which is done automatically, generally the same day or a day before expiration, so you want to be sure you don't end up paying one more month by accident).

It is not a "crisis" of GPUs, the other account(s) still get them regularly (still P100). I will keep a closer watch and unsubscribe with the other accounts just a day (or two) before termination.


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